Blogger Alleges GMOs in US Wellness Meats Grass-Fed Beef
Last week, a blog called Living It Up Corn Free made the allegation that Missouri-based grass-fed beef producer US Wellness Meats’ products are contaminated with GMOs. The blogger is severely allergic to corn, and she claims that she reacted to a GM-corn-based lactic acid solution that is sprayed on the outer carcass layer immediately after hide removal. Here’s the link.
The following was posed on her blog:
[US Wellness Meats] confirmed that they are using lactic acid (citric acid’s evil twin and a powerful GM corn-derived anti-bacterial) at the processing plant. The ground beef contains a higher concentration because it is made from the trim off roasts and steaks, therefore, more heavily sprayed areas make up the ground beef.
The blogger continues:
The government requires the processing plants to use powerful anti-bacterial sprays directly on the carcass to combat the spread of E. coli. If you saw the process, believe me, you would be in favor of spraying whatever it took to kill all the contaminants that are on these carcasses.
My problem is that the anti-bacterial spray that they use is made with GM corn and I cannot tolerate even a little bit of it.
I was initially shocked by these allegations, but then as I read the post again, I became suspicious as the blogger did not credit any sources, nor did she go into any detail about how the meat was processed or how the lactic acid spray was used. As much as I dearly love and respect bloggers and other “citizen journalists,” I also recognize the importance of presenting sources and references for the claims we make. It’s easy to write a blog post. It takes a lot more work to actually do the research to find out the truth.
While I feel empathy for the blogger who suffered an allergic reaction, I also felt bad for US Wellness Meats having a claim of “GMO contaminated” leveled at them. They work hard to produce healthy food for us and they are a company I endorse wholeheartedly. I needed to get the facts.
I spent the better part of that day calling around, talking to grass farmers, butchers and meat processors. I also spoke with Mark Kastel at the organic watchdog group, The Cornucopia Institute; Jeffrey Smith, author of Seeds of Deception, founder of The Institute for Responsible Technology, and global expert on GMOs; Sally Fallon Morell, President of the Weston A. Price Foundation and author of Nourishing Traditions.
Here’s what I found out.
Report from US Wellness Meats
I contacted US Wellness Meats first to find out what they had to say. Farmer John Wood told me that he had spoken to his processor and while it’s true, they do use a lactic acid spray in the processing of the beef, they do not believe that it is harmful in any way. John explained to me that the fermentation that occurs is the act of living fermentation bacteria acting like a factory using corn sugar as a fuel to produce lactic acid. This is the same product humans produce every day in our muscles.
John spoke to a few different people at PURAC, the company that manufactures the lactic acid spray (the specific product is called FCC88). I also called Purac myself. The people John and I talked to stated that while they do use a percentage of Midwest corn to make the lactic acid (which is derived from the sugar from the corn), they have have labeled the lactic acid spray “GMO non-detectable”. They said this means there is no detectable GMO DNA in the lactic acid product.
PURAC FCC88 is approved for organic cattle. The people at PURAC also said that the GM proteins cannot survive the process of lactic fermentation. I was not able to verify this. PURAC also sent a letter stating that there is no GMO DNA present in the lactic acid product, FCC88. Click here to download the letter.
What Other Farmers Had to Say
After I got off the phone with US Wellness Meats, the first person I called was Carole Albrecht at Chaffin Family Orchards. Chaffin Family Orchards is one of the farms that I personally order from for our grass-fed beef. Carole confirmed that they are using the same brand of PURAC’s lactic acid (FCC88).
Carole called their processor, then called me back with explained to me the process of harvesting the cows. According to my notes from my phone call with Carole, this is what happens:
They slaughter or “harvest” the animals, then rinse them down with very hot water. They then spray the carcass with the lactic acid spray. Then they hang and chill the carcass for 30 days. They spray it with the lactic acid right before it goes into the chill. The carcass hangs for somewhere between 14-30 days at a very cold temperature close to freezing.
Over time, as they meat hangs and tenderizes, a grey stuff grows on the outside. After the aging, they then trim all of that exterior off before they cut the meat. According to Carole, “The actual lactic acid product does not even end up on the meat.” She said of course there’s always a small chance that it might not be cut off — but she said that would be very unlikely.
I also spoke to Chris Kerston at Chaffin. Chris is extremely knowledgeable about sustainable farming. He told me that the lactic acid spray was standard. Except for the bigger processing plants, which are using ammonia to wash their beef. This was referred to in the movie, Food Inc.
Chris also told me that grass-fed beef producers really don’t have a choice on who they use for a processor. He said that in Northern California, there is one USDA plant that will work with small producers. “Bigger plants won’t work with you unless you’ve got 48,000 pounds, which is about 60 steers,” said Kerston.
The View from a Small Meat Processor
Chris Johansen, organically certified harvester in Orland, CA, has 8 employees. Chris works alongside his employees, harvesting and processing carcasses from small farmers. He is the processor who butchers meat for Chaffin Family Orchards.
Chris explained the process to me over the phone (paraphrase). They take the carcass, spray it with 2% lactic acid solution. He stressed that the lactic acid solution is 98% water. They then roll the carcass into the cooler and let it hang for 21 days. After that time, the outside surface that has been sprayed with the lactic acid solution, that is trimmed off and thrown away. So, according to Chris, the exposure consumers would have to this lactic acid solution is “very minimal”.
He said that the bigger plants (the ones that aren’t using ammonia) typically don’t trim off the lactic acid — because they are want to get more yield. Chris said that lactic acid has been proven scientifically to reduce/control/eliminate E. coli 157H7.
Statement from Sally Fallon Morell
Next I contacted Sally Fallon Morell via email. I sent her an email with the background and the claims that had been made about GMOs in the meat. She wrote back with the following statement:
I have no problems with the lactic acid treatment — sounds quite natural. Would be better if he got the lactic acid from whey, however. Sally
Statement from Jeffrey Smith
I also contacted author Jeffrey Smith, leading expert on GMOs. Here is the statement Jeffrey sent me:
The more you process a crop into an ingredient, usually the less risk there is. For example, if there is no DNA left in a GM corn derivative, you no longer have the risk associated with inserted foreign genes transferring into bacteria living inside our intestines (which was confirmed to happen with GM soy transgenes, for example). Highly processed corn derivatives are often free of protein as well. This means that the protein produced by the inserted gene, such as Bt-toxin produced by Bt corn, would also be absent.
What risk remains? Since the process of genetic engineering can create massive collateral damage in the natural functioning DNA, a GM plant may have new toxins, allergens, or other harmful elements, or higher levels of existing toxins, etc. The superficial safety tests that are done by the GMO companies cannot identify most of these unpredictable changes in the GM plant. For a processed ingredient that is free of both protein and DNA, it is still theoretically possible that it may contain one of more of these harmful elements that have survived the steps of processing. Since no one tests for this, there is no way to evaluate the degree of risk.
Certainly, if this processed ingredient is only in minute quantities in the final product, the risk is usually diminished even further.
[My note on Jeffrey's statement: It should be mentioned that the processed ingredient, PURAC's FCC88 lactic acid spray, is not actually in the finished product -- at least in the case of US Wellness Meats and Chaffin Family Orchards. As mentioned above, according to both of their processors, the part of the carcass that is sprayed with the FCC88 is cut away. This may not be true at bigger meat processing plants. However, as mentioned above, many bigger meat processing plants use an ammonia wash instead of the lactic acid spray.]
My Conclusion
I have great empathy for the blogger who had the allergic reaction. I know some people have very serious allergies. I just heard a story on mp3 that Dr. Nick Gonzales told at the Weston A. Price Foundation Wise Traditions conference in the fall of 2009. It was about a woman who was so allergic and toxic that she could not drive within 10 miles of the ocean without her epi-pen. Apparently she would go into anaphylactic shock due to her allergy to iodine.
The sicker and more toxic we become, the more allergic we become to everyday things that other people have no problems with — from chemical sensitivity to gluten intolerance to the inability to drink milk or eat butter. I myself became very sick and allergic to gluten and had major chemical sensitivities when I was in my twenties. I radically changed my diet, was on a supplement protocol, and, after two years of this, I was able to eat anything again with no problems.
As much as I empathize with someone who is suffering, I question whether an allergy reaction warrants an attack on a small farm. Based on what I learned from my research, I do not personally feel that there is any risk. I will continue to buy meat from US Wellness Meats and Chaffin Orchards. In fact, just a few days ago I placed an order for ten pounds of liverwurst from US Wellness. I am very conscientious about the food I eat, and work very hard to avoid GMOs in my diet. I feel perfectly safe eating the food US Wellness Meats produces, and I’m extremely grateful for their hard work and dedication.
This post is part of Fight Back Friday at Food Renegade.
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05/02/2010 at 12:53 pm Permalink
hi annemarie,
such a bummer. i found one local meatshop here that makes liverwurst, but they put dried milk powder and sodium nitrate in it. i want to stay away from both of those things, but would my benefit of beef and pork liver (or was it pork and beef liver?) from pigs and cows (who i am not sure lived a happy properly well-fed life) out weigh the bad. i’m kind of doubting it as i type. but, i would love your input. i could see my family enjoying that kind of thing on a sandwich with homemade lf mayo and sourdough. maybe i should just try to make a homemade pate instead…
)
i’ve been on the lookout for locally made liverwurst sausage (stuff other than the corn syrup laden store bought stuff…). my hopes were high as i looked at the us wellness meats website. oh how i would love to order MANY things from them. but, it’s a $75 minimum and they don’t ship to alaska.
i would love to hear back from you! thanks, annemarie
(or maybe i could pay you to ship me one pound of your recently ordered package?
05/02/2010 at 1:02 pm Permalink
Wow. What a great and informative post. Thank you for all the work that went into that. I would have been shocked had I come across that blog, and I feel much better now.
Thanks.
Molly
Molly Chester´s last blog ..Technique: Sprouted Flour Part I
05/02/2010 at 1:09 pm Permalink
Great Post! Thanks for shining a light on a little known fact about meat processing. Some people seem to think just because there is a whiff of GM taint in a product that it gives them a right to attack whoever come in contact with such a product. Granted, GM technology on the whole is evil in the way it manipulates and spreads and is under monopolistic corporate control. However, it is here–a fact of life–and we’d better all understand it more so we can lessen its impact on the future.
Another common carcass spray is derived from Hydrogen Peroxide and Vinegar. This per-acetic acid is very powerful and I use something similar at home to break the cycle of bleach when I clean my dairy dishes and wooden counter-tops. First I spray the Peroxide–because it’s cool when if foams and highlights protein sources immediately–and then the vinegar and let it sit for a few minutes. It helps if you use stronger, home-made vinegar for this and a dairy strength peroxide. But, if you use commercial white vinegar, you have to watch for where and how it is made. Most white vinegars are from distilled grains–usually corn. Hence, another GM product source. Is there really any escape??
When buying meat it really pays to do your research, as you have shown. It also helps to buy from small producers and local sources. If the animals are clean of muck, debris, and liquids before they go to slaughter they are less likely to contaminate the meat while skinning takes place and a good slaughterman uses discretion when applying expensive carcass washes. Just enough and not too much achieves the job without waste or overkill.
Keep on doing such great work!
05/02/2010 at 1:15 pm Permalink
Erin -
Oh, that is too bad!
I have bought liverwurst before with those ingredients from Whole Foods. While it was not ideal, I really wanted to eat liver and I felt that the benefits outweighed the risks of small amounts of additives.
I am going to post about how to make liverwurst sausage at home in the coming months. Stay tuned!
In the meantime, you might consider also eating more Alaskan seafood, particularly shellfish and mollusks. Shellfish, and most particularly mollusks are chock-full of nutrients — they’re right up there with organ meats.
05/02/2010 at 1:17 pm Permalink
Ann Marie,
You’re a detective, that’s why I trust most everything you say! A hound for the truth! Thank you for researching the things a lot of us don’t have the time to research ourselves and for keeping us informed.
Gena @ Girl Gone Domestic´s last blog ..The Washington Alliance for Raw Milk
05/02/2010 at 1:24 pm Permalink
@ Podchef
I always appreciate your comments.
05/02/2010 at 1:32 pm Permalink
This is indeed a very unfortunate situation, but I think I’m with you Ann Marie. Also, at some point we simply run out of choices of what’s completely healthy to eat. Because if this meat isn’t healthy to eat, what can we consume?
Some years ago when I was very sick from my lifestyle habits, I was absorbing so little and had become so malnourished that I reacted to certain things when I started back on real foods and nutrients. My nutritional therapist had me taking a nutraceutical product called Eniva for a period of time along with eating a real food diet because I was so incredibly depleted.
Eniva is one of a myriad of supplements on the market that packs real food nutrients into one product. While it has a flawless reputation for “bringing people back to health”, and it does not contain GMOs, it is not organically-sourced. And, it’s a nutrient supplement, so I wouldn’t necessarily endorse it over whole, real foods. While Eniva is not something I take anymore, I am grateful to have had it for awhile because it helped to jumpstart my body back to health. I began breaking out in a rash when I first started taking it. I stopped for awhile, and then when I had my next appointment I told her about it and she laughed and said, “you need to keep taking it.” I was astonished as to why she would say this. She explained, “your body has been deprived of nutrition so long, it’s like you’ve been in the desert for two days with no water, and your body needs those nutrients so badly it causes a reaction.”
I also believe, and have heard about people reacting violently to certain things due to high levels of toxicity and allergies in the body. One of the best examples I can think of is a friend who has had an allergic reaction to the sun for the last several years. One day she went out in the sun for about 6 or 7 hours and she got one of the worst sunburns I’ve ever seen, including swelling in her face and extremeties to the point where she couldn’t wear her contact lenses and could barely put on her glasses.
To this day, she still claims she can’t go out into the sun and really never does. I explained to her that she likely has a severe Vitamin D deficiency and that maybe going on fermented cod liver oil would help. I did give her the link to Green Pastures, and encouraged her to purchase it, but then later she told me she was using a brand from the health food store. Her sun sensitivity has not improved.
It just goes to prove that when people use inferior substances instead of the real thing and don’t see results, they may tend to blame the remedy they tried and believe it didn’t work – but in reality, the method they use didn’t work because it wasn’t real food.
I think this is one way toxicities and allergies are allowed to perpetuate themselves, because some people don’t believe in the power or value of real food to reverse their health problems. They think trying a quick fix, using an inferior product that mimics the real thing, or just making one change for a few weeks is sufficient. When they don’t get the results they are told should come, they draw the conclusion that they should just go back to their old ways because their attempt failed…but in reality, they didn’t go the whole distance and use real food to solve the problem…just a cheap facsimile.
Raine Saunders´s last blog ..Gallbladder Disease and The Standard American Diet – My Personal Account
05/02/2010 at 1:39 pm Permalink
@ Raine
I want to learn more about how vitamin D status affects our ability to tolerate sun and not burn. Do you know more about this?
I’ve been marveling this past couple years at how I never get sunburns anymore. This is ever since we have been taking the Blue Ice cod liver oil.
The same thing has happened with my husband, in-laws and even my toddler. We just don’t seem to burn. Even when Seth and I went to Hawaii, and when my inlaws went to Costa Rica. No sunscreen, we stayed in the sun all day with skin exposed — and no burn.
05/02/2010 at 1:48 pm Permalink
Great investigative work, Ann Marie!
Melissa @CelluliteInvestigation´s last blog .."Mommy, Where Does Fluoride Come From?"
05/02/2010 at 1:56 pm Permalink
Thank you for your article and research!
I read that same blogpost……I had planned to make my first UsWellness Meats order very soon, when I read that post attacking them. I hesitated for a couple of days but ordered anyway. I feel much better about that after reading your post.
05/02/2010 at 1:57 pm Permalink
Ann Marie, thank you for doing all the research to set the record straight for us and other grass fed farmers!
Hi Erin, I work for US Wellness Meats and am proud to do so! I know first-hand the precautions we take to provide outstanding products! Thank you for your interest in our products! I have good news for you! We do ship to Alaska and we don’t charge more for it! You just have to pay the standard handling fee of $7.50! Give us a call if you have ANY questions! (877) 383-0051
05/02/2010 at 2:27 pm Permalink
Megan – Oh GREAT! I thought you did ship to Alaska, but then I wasn’t sure. Great news for Erin!
I am personally so grateful for your liverwurst and Braunschweiger. It’s a form of organ meats my 2-year-old daughter will happily eat, and I love them, too. So thrilled that my freezer is loaded up with organ sausage!
05/02/2010 at 2:33 pm Permalink
Timely post for me. We send our first two hogs to the processor on Monday and we’re meeting with the owners of the slaughterhouse today to nail down all the details (cuts, packaging, spices/ingredients for sausage, etc.) I had never thought about what kind of solution they’d be required to use by USDA, so that question has been added to the list. When I sell my pork, I want to be able to vouch for the whole process. Thanks for digging up the details!
05/02/2010 at 2:37 pm Permalink
Wow! What amazing detective work! I guess I haven’t thought about it that much because the farmers I buy from now use one of three local processors and the way it works here — which I know from personal experience because I’ve bought whole animals and have had the live animals dropped off at the processor and worked directly with the meat processor myself — is that the live animals are dropped off with the meat processors who have the “cut orders” available for pick up within two to three days. Of course, the difference here could be that these are small processors who are working with family farmers (though one in particular does have some wholesale contracts in addition to having a retail store). The animals aren’t being hung for long periods of time here. I don’t know if they are spraying the animals with any solutions after slaughtering them, but now I’m definitely motivated to call and ask!
05/02/2010 at 2:38 pm Permalink
Excellent post Ann Marie. Thank you!
05/02/2010 at 2:40 pm Permalink
Ann Marie – I don’t know much more than what I’ve experienced myself, observed in people I know, and a bit of research I’ve done this past year since that great post you wrote about the Vitamin D deficiency running rampant in children and adults. I read somewhere that most of the time when skin cancer is diagnosed, it’s in a place that receives the least amount of sun expsoure (often it’s melanoma), which makes sense if you consider that Vitamin D has a connection to protecting us from cancer. Did I read that on your site? I can’t remember.
Here’s some interesting information from the Vitamin D council encouraging people to actually get sun exposure to build up Vitamin D in their bodies to healthy levels – this is really good to hear – although it does say to take supplementation and doesn’t mention anything about dietary sources of Vitamin D like from pasture-raised meats, eggs, butter, lard, bacon, and cod liver oil.
http://www.vitamindcouncil.org/
I have also heard that after the age of 50, our bodies become increasingly unable to convert Vitamin D from the sun into a viable store in our systems. This is probably due to the aging process to some extent. But I would think that if your diet was good and included real foods, that might not necessarily be true. As we age and if we are not correctly supporting our bodies, it would seem as though all our functions and processes would consequently start failing as many people’s do when they are not mindful of diet and lifestyle. And if you are in elder years, the effect would no doubt be compounded, I would think.
There is this other really fantastic organization called SUNARC –
http://www.sunarc.org/
I have visited their site multiple times and I am really impressed with their research. There was an article I wrote awhile back where I quoted something from this site and the doctor who is the head of the organization, but now I can’t find the article. Their mission is to research the effects of dietary and lifestyle choices on disease. There is a link on the front page to a document about the effects of maternal Vitamin D levels and the development of infantile autism on their front page it’s a Word Document that you have to either save or open it on your computer. It’s a really interesting!
But I do know this – like you, I have been taking cod liver oil for just under two year. For the first year we took Carlson’s and I think it was okay, but not great. I’m trying to remember when it was that I switched to Green Pastures (Blue Ice Royal) – I think it was just under a year ago. I did stop taking it during the summer months to save money and because I was out in the sun almost every day.
I’m a person who has typically sunburned my entire life if I stayed out too long, or unless I applied sunscreen, but I did notice that my sunburns were much milder and less frequent last summer that they have ever been, and I felt great as well. I bet if I took the cod liver oil consistently through the year that when the hot weather comes again I’d probably have even better results. I will definitely have to do an experiment to find out whether my theory is true!
Have you ever been a person that sunburned before you started taking the Blue Ice? There must be some research available about this somewhere. I definitely believe that sunblock does prevent sunburn because we took a trip to Mexico two years ago and the one day I didn’t apply sunscreen to my back when we were at the beach, I received one of the worst sunburns of my life. I wonder if this is because I wasn’t taking my cod liver oil yet?
I’m still not convinced sunscreen is good for us to use. What’s interesting is that I started buying the most safe sunscreen for my son when he was first born (you know, the brands that use mineral block instead of chemical, and all organic like Badger), but I frequently forgot to put sunscreen on him And he has never had a sunburn in his life (he’s 9) except for one time he got a little bit red when we were out in the sun for an extended period of time. Now I don’t use sunscreen anymore except my father will insist on putting some on him occasionally when they go out, so I give him the Badger brand since I still have some in the house. My Dad doesn’t buy into the whole idea of natural protection from the sun from a real foods diet.
Very interesting conversation, and one that definitely deserves more thought, experimentation, and research!
Raine Saunders´s last blog ..Gallbladder Disease and The Standard American Diet – My Personal Account
05/02/2010 at 2:44 pm Permalink
Great post! As a fan of U.S. Wellness meats (and as a reporter) I appreciate your digging around for the truth and not just repeating what you heard!
I’m glad to see them exonerated.
I think you really hit the nail on the head when you wrote “The sicker and more toxic we become, the more allergic we become to everyday things that other people have no problems with . . .”
Have you ever read “The Autoimmune Epidemic?” Great read. It essentially expands on that premise — toxic doses from the environment and foods affect us all differently depending on our own genetic make-up, which perhaps explains why some people are so resistant to changing their habits. After all, everyone bleed when hit by a bullet, but only some of us break our in hives, or have migraines, or get arthritis etc. etc. from food additives and chemicals.
Aggie´s last blog ..Caveman on Colbert
05/02/2010 at 2:51 pm Permalink
There are several problems but the biggest is that you have at least 1 completely unanswered question that are directly relevant to the allergic blogger.
The industry doesnt have a sensitive assay for the protein or proteins nor is there an appreciation for nor markers for the relevant antigenic epitopes that may be raising the allergic reaction in the blogger (and who else?). Likely no one knows yet what those proteins are. Further, GMO proteins may have sufficient changes such that they are not detected by standard non-GMO protein assays, escaping detection. Further, ELISA tests are expensive and take some time, reasons the industry will not adopt the assays. Just because you do not test for it doesnt mean its not there.
(did you know that the US doesnt test for BSE? This way they can say none has been detected)
Assays for “DNA” in a product is a false flag. GMO producers likely pushed this as an assay because they know the following. Anyone with even the most rudimentary experience in the lab knows that most of the world outside of the interphase nucleus is toxic to DNA, eats it to pieces. Further, to get transfection of DNA into a target host, you need not only fully intact DNA sequence, you need flanking sequence that mediates insertion, something that is not designed to be present in GMO products. These flanking sequences (can be plasmids or larger artificial chromosome constructs, etc) are equally sensitive to degradation and without sufficient sequence similarity will not function to insert DNA into a target host. When we speak of studies that show transfection (commenter above) what the studies have actually shown is NOT human tissues picking up transgenes but the bacteria in the gut. Bacterial (prokaryotic) genetics and mechanisms for reproduction are substantially different from ours (eukaryotic) and MAY allow for integration of ambient DNAs or RNA BUT there again is the issue of these sequences making it through an intensely anti-DNA/RNA environment.
I am completely NOT PRO-GMO but I am educated on this matter.
I would not feel assured that there are not proteins in this lactic acid just because a company that doesnt test for it says its not there.
Do not assume also that just because something is the product of fermentation that its the same as the pickles and kefir burbling on your countertop.
High-throughput industrial fermentation depends on the same biochemistry but the process happens under highly accelerated, optimized, and chemicalized conditions in bioreactors larger than your house.
The large functional problem you are up against is this: the abbatoirs in this country have been whittled down to a very few who are mega global conglomerates with no real accountability to anyone. If they say they will use lactic acid, they will. The USDA will rubber stamp what ever it is they say they will use as well.
What we need is artisan abbatoirs that use, as Fallon suggests, natural non-GMO products from the moment the animal enters the premises.
Until then, you will be dealing with this issue (as well as others not brought out here).
nika´s last blog ..Egg recipe contest almost over!
05/02/2010 at 2:53 pm Permalink
Thanks for some great detective work! I’m looking forward to your post on making liverwurst–I’m like you–right now I’m getting it at Whole Foods but would rather make my own so I don’t get those additives.
I think that anyone can have allergies to anything. The stronger our gut flora the less likely this is going to happen. It could be that this particular blogger is particularly sensitive to corn–there are those who can’t eat anything that has even touched the item that they are allergic too–celiacs can be this way and some with nightshade allergies. I do not believe that that means that US Wellness Meats has done anything wrong. It sounds like they are using the most natural process they have to cure their meats.
Bonnie´s last blog ..Commitment
05/02/2010 at 2:58 pm Permalink
Very informative, but where’s the interview with the blogger?? I wish you would have interviewed the blogger for both sides of the story. This article appears to have been written with the sole intention of backing US Wellness. While I understand that they go through great lengths to have very high quality meats and I will still continue to buy from them. I’m very sad to hear that all the people you did interview are backing to continue to use this product derived from GMOs… sigh. We should be looking into the hydrogen peroxide & vinegar way or hot water even, like the Europeans, and really make the stand, absolutely NO GMOs!!! We can still continue to support US Wellness while asking for no GMOs and moving towards that instead of reporting that they are OK.
05/02/2010 at 3:08 pm Permalink
I LOVE US WELLNESS MEATS! I found them through the Nourishing Traditions bloggers and I’m so incredibly grateful. I have two young sons and they eat the liverwurst, head cheese and braunschweiger like it was ice cream. I’ve talked with representatives of US Wellness meats twice and both times they were super informative and nice. I love this company. I love their meats. I love their service. I trust them wholeheartedly. I literally just got an order of ground lamb, bones (to make broth), sausages, and lamb tallow. It’s sitting on my front porch and when I’m done writing this comment, I’ll go get it. I order from them at least twice a month.
Ann Marie, I have a question regarding Gaps. I asked this question on Yahoo Gaps Support but never got an answer. My kids and I are on the Gaps Intro Diet. We are on day ten. We are eating head cheese, liverwurst and braunschwieger with no problems. I have some raw braunschwieger(from US Wellness Meats) and some beef from an organic local grass-fed farm – I’ve been to the farm. Do you think that it would be ok to serve my kids raw meats on the Intro? The enzymes are still there and it would be easier for them to digest. I would brown it a bit so not completely raw.
Also, do you know where to get pastured pig fat or lard? I haven’t been able to get ahold of my pig farmer to get any. US Wellness Meats said that I could buy some from them but I would have to get 60lbs of fat. I don’t need 60lbs. I really want lard as I like the taste and it’s needed on the gaps diet (fats are needed.) I have beef tallow and now lamb tallow but I’m not a fan of beef tallow although I will continue to eat it.
I wanted to ask a question about yours stools while you were on Gaps – but I’ll save that for those on the gaps support group. This isn’t the post for such questions:)
05/02/2010 at 3:10 pm Permalink
Thank you so much for taking the time to investigate all this! I remember the original post and was wondering what anyone had found out.
Thanks again – we all appreciate the time you put into it!
05/02/2010 at 3:34 pm Permalink
Wow, Ann Marie, I really do appreciate the time you take to do proper research and give us the information we need to make fully informed decisions. The more educated we are about our food and how it’s processed, the better decisions we can make about what we eat and where it comes from.
Elizabeth @ The Nourished Life´s last blog ..5 Ways You’ll Benefit from Daily Deep Breathing Exercises
05/02/2010 at 3:36 pm Permalink
I too am grateful for the time and effort you put into this post. I am lucky enough to have local source for grass fed beef and have never ordered from US wellness. I do, however, agree with Gina above. That was the one thing left out. I read the original blog post last week, and the blogger was describing her reaction. If I was her, I would probably be feeling a little embarrassed getting such a big reaction from you and wishing that I could explain my point of view.
That being said, I do appreciate getting all the facts and learning more about the whole process.
chanelle´s last blog ..Uses for Kitchen Scraps
05/02/2010 at 4:40 pm Permalink
That our government will not allow testing for BSE is dispicable. Even the ranchers who would be willing to pay for the testing are not allowed to test for BSE. That’s bull*hit. If masses of US citizens found out that the meat they were eating could have come from a cow with mad cow disease, ranchers would have to do something about it because no one would eat beef again. Not to mention the fact that other countries would NEVER buy our meat again.
That’s why I buy meat from US wellness and local farms.
05/02/2010 at 5:00 pm Permalink
@ Gina
I do not think the people I interviewed were “backing” the use of GMO corn to make the lactic acid spray. Well, maybe PURAC was. But other than that, no one did.
But this is not such an easy issue. Nika (comment above) may be correct that “What we need is artisan abbatoirs that use, as Fallon suggests, natural non-GMO products from the moment the animal enters the premises”. However, these farmers don’t have a lot of control over what they processors use. They have, as Chris Kerston mentioned, very little control over the processor they use to begin with.
As far as interviewing the blogger, that might have added something to the story. I did read her emails back and forth with John Wood of US Wellness Meats (she sent them to me). But there really wasn’t much there. She claimed that she got sick (allergic reaction to corn) from the meat. It’s very circumstantial. If she had been eating nothing but ground beef from US Wellness Meats for a period of a few days or a week, then maybe there would be more weight to it. But she was eating other things so I’m not sure how one could ascertain that the meat caused the reaction.
And even if the lactic acid solution that was once on the meat did cause the allergic reaction, I still thought her post was incendiary and full of unsubstantiated claims (the # 1 one being that the meat was “contaminated”). I just don’t think it’s fair to say that, based on what I learned.
Anyway, not sure what it really would have added to the story to include an interview with the blogger. I couldn’t think of any questions I could have asked her that would have shed any more light on the issue. If you can think of some, let me know and I’ll ask her.
05/02/2010 at 5:08 pm Permalink
@ Tina
Absolutely I would serve it raw or rare if they will eat it! Good for you!
There are a number of Amish farmers who sell lard and many of them will ship. Do you get the Wise Traditions quarterly journal? Go and join the WAPF as a member — it’s like $40/year. You’ll get it and you’ll also get the shopping guide — both list lots of farmers. What I do often times is buy the pig fat and then render it myself.
I use my beef tallow mainly for deep frying — that’s my favorite use for it. Oh, and I also use it to make baked goods — my other fave use. On GAPS, you could make onion rings or chicken nuggets or fried clams, what have you — just dredge the food in beaten eggs, then coconut flour or finely ground almond meal.
For baked goods — I have a recipe for coconut flour bacon/egg muffins on my site. You could use bacon fat or tallow in that.
I also really like the refined expeller pressed coconut oil.
LOL! about the stools.
05/02/2010 at 5:13 pm Permalink
@ Chanelle
Good point!
I’m not a professional investigative journalist, nor do I ever aspire to be. So I don’t really know what I’m doing — didn’t go to school for this! (I did get my degree in Radio/TV/Film w/ a specialization in New Media — so I guess I know how to blog but no one ever trained me to be a reporter.)
I did try to talk to as many relevant people as possible, and try to get my questions answered. And as I said, I did communicate w/ the blogger via email and read her emails with USWM. I just couldn’t think of anything to ask her, other than, “So you’re sure it was the meat?” She had no evidence for that so I didn’t see the point. But you’re right, I could have offered her the chance to respond — that would have been the right thing to do.
I don’t think the blogger needs to be embarrassed — but we do need to be careful about what we write on the internet.
05/02/2010 at 5:18 pm Permalink
Hi Ann Marie–
I just made liverwurst myself for the first time–using meat and organs from our locally raised hog. It turned out so good…my 4-year-old was begging for it! You should try it. http://lostartskitchen.blogspot.com/2010/02/when-life-hands-you-liver.html
Recently, there was a discussion about lactic acid “wash” on meat within a food buying club that prompted me to do some similar research of my own. We get our meat here in Oregon from the Deck Family Farm and neither their custom processor, Four Star Meats (which processes animals that people buy from them “on the hoof”), nor their USDA-inspected processor, Dayton Meat Co, use lactic acid. Four Star simply washes carcasses with water before aging; Dayton uses a vinegar solution.
Grassfed cattle have the healthy guts, which means that even if they are exposed to E. coli, their bodies can kill off the bacteria. Careful processing, that keeps gut material from ever coming in contact with the rest of the carcass, prevents the spread of any E. coli as well. A careful butcher, washing the carcasses of healthy animals with lactic acid, whether any GM material remains in the solution or the final product, seems utterly superfluous.
I don’t believe that GM food is here to stay–so much research and experience is demonstrating that it bodes ill for us–as eaters, farmers, and citizens of the world. I don’t want it in my body or in the world at large. Trying to excuse the use of GM products with the assertion that it doesn’t stay on the meat seems kinda “NIMBY” to me–as long as it doesn’t enter *my* body, it’s okay? Those ears of GM corn were grown out in a field somewhere and the stories of GM contamination abound and many farmers have lost their livelihoods thanks to the unscrupulous behavior of companies like Monsanto. I’m no purist, but I wouldn’t knowingly buy meat from a company that uses GM products and contends that “they do not believe that it is harmful in any way.” Please look for local farms, raising animals ethically, and processors who do not use GM products. They are out there.
05/02/2010 at 5:47 pm Permalink
@ Chris
Your recipe looks great! I’ll check it out. Only I can’t get pork heart, I don’t think. I did get pork liver once. Can it be made with beef liver and beef heart? If so, how many ounces do I use?
I agree with you that it would be ideal if processors did not use the lactic acid spray that is made from GM corn. However, that lactic acid solution is 98% WATER and only 2% lactic acid… and it doesn’t actually stay on the meat — it’s cut off and discarded.
I do go out of my way to avoid GM corn tortillas and other products that are made primarily of GMOs. However, I am not always successful. I do try.
To say that we must avoid GMOs 100% of the time is unrealistic and impossible. If you drive a car, the gas you put in it has ethanol. Soy lecithin is also in many, many foods.
I just can’t say that I will never eat GMOs. I do still eat out in restaurants. I also get exposed to chemicals and heavy metals and radiation on a daily basis. We all do! Like it or not, this is life on planet earth.
I suppose I could build a plastic bubble in my house, like John Travolta in that 1970s movie. But I don’t think I want to do that! We just need to do the best we can in the real world.
05/02/2010 at 6:53 pm Permalink
I want to add my thank you for your investigating this and other issues. I will be picking up a side of beef from a processor within the next two weeks and I am going to ask them what they use.
05/02/2010 at 8:13 pm Permalink
Hi,
I am just wondering why US Wellness Meats uses lactic acid, when it is proven that spraying with hot water is much more effective?
Thanks!
05/02/2010 at 9:13 pm Permalink
Ann Marie,
Thanks for researching this. My heart was sinking as I read the first few sentences of this post. I am a regular US Wellness customer and am grateful for the meat they provide. The research in the post makes me comfortable in continuing to buy their meat!
05/02/2010 at 9:35 pm Permalink
Hi, I am the “blogger in question” that had the allergic reaction to the US Wellness ground beef. While I am disappointed that Ann Marie would write a post justifying the use of lactic acid sprays on pastured meat, I guess I am not surprised since US Wellness is one of her sponsors. They were one of my sponsors until this GMO corn reaction happened and I recommended them everywhere even before they became my sponsor.
My children and I are currently doing the GAPS diet which revolves around meat, veggies and bone broth, so safe meat is a very important part our diet. We had previously been ordering and eating roasts from US Wellness Meats with no obvious corn reactions. All three of us are allergic to corn and soy and all three of us instantly reacted to the ground beef. While it is hard to determine the source of an allergen sometimes, in this case (situation described in my blog) there was no doubt. When I wrote to Mr. Wood I already knew there was corn in the final product because of our reaction to it, my only question was how corn got into my expensive pasture raised meats. Until this allergic reaction, I never even knew to inquire about meat processing procedures or sprays.
His explanation that there was such a small amount used (2%) and that it is required by the USDA did not satisfy me. Obviously 2% is enough to cause an allergic reaction so that tells me that GMO corn is in the final product. The USDA does require an antibacterial spray to be used on the carcasses, but they do not specify that it must be made from GMO corn. I am more than a little disgusted that my pasture raised meat was processed using the cheapest GMO sprays. Lactic acid can be sourced from other grains as mentioned in the comment by Sally Fallon above.
By the way, I did a lot of research on the subject, too. Consider this: All meat processed in this country to be exported to the EU is sprayed only with hot water since they don’t allow GMOs. This results in a reduction of e.coli prevalence by 81%. Meat destined for our consumption (including expensive, pasture raised meat) is sprayed with a lactic acid solution (GMO corn derived antibacterial). This results in a reduction of e.coli prevalence by 35%. There is a huge problem in the way that we are processing our foods and everyone in the world seems to know it but us.
This whole experience with US Wellness Meats has taught me one thing: My corn/soy allergy is a pretty effective GMO detector. If you do any reading about the dangers of GMOs, you will wish that you had a detector, too. When everyone else is munching away on REAL foods that are contaminated with GMOs, ignorant of the damage being done to their bodies, my family will only be eating REAL foods free of all bioengineered toxins. Of course if you believe John Woods and Ann Marie, a little bit won’t hurt us.
kc´s last blog ..GMOs in Pasture Raised Meat
05/02/2010 at 10:46 pm Permalink
Ann Marie, good for you for so conscientiously tracking this down. I think the original blogger acted more than a bit irresponsibly. It’s easy to damage a reputation, hard to win it back. It can be very difficult to trace the actual cause of an allergic reaction. I hope she follows your example and brings herself back to health through a nutrient-dense diet and proper supplementation. As Sally Fallon Morrell has said, getting sufficient A and D, etc, in our diets helps us to deal with the toxins that are inextricably part of our environment now.
Jeanmarie´s last blog ..Coconut Ghee, the Perfect Cooking Fat
06/02/2010 at 1:12 am Permalink
The blogger said US Wellness meat is sprayed with GMO corn derived lactic acid and she is exactly right. It’s well above responsible to report that in a corn free lifestyle blog.
I was shocked and frustrated. Talked to all the educated eaters and no one knew. Did some research. John at US Wellness discussed it with me as he was researching in response to the same blog.
I’ve read all the reasons here that GMO corn might no make it onto my plate. None of those provide any guarantee. One thing will; hit that aspiring sirloin with lactic acid not from corn. Or the 200 degree euro-bath.
06/02/2010 at 1:14 am Permalink
Thanks so much for posting all your research AnnMarie. Thanks too to KC who posted some more information.
It’s amazing to me to see how much effort it takes to be informed on such matters. This has helped me understand questions I need to ask.
06/02/2010 at 1:37 am Permalink
I have been allergic to corn since I was an infant, and was fed a formula made from cow milk and corn syrup. And I’m also allergic to sulfites, which are used in the wet milling of much of the corn. I’m a Celiac, who has been totally gluten free since diagnosis, many years ago. No cheating, ever!
I have very severe allergic reactions to all corn derivatives. This includes lactic acid, and citric acid that are used to treat meats, and produce.
Lactic acid and citric acid are used in the meat packaging, and soaker pads, too. I am in many corn allergy support groups, as well as sulfite allergy groups. It is almost impossible for us to find safe meat to eat. We can not tolerate the treated meats, and corn/sulfites from the packaging materials. This also applies to produce and any other food product that is loaded with corn, in one form or another. It doesn’t matter if companies claim there is no detectable corn protein, because there are other components of corn that cause severe allergic reactions, not just protein.
So the corn in treated meat causes me to have severe allergy symptoms, including hives, angioedema, swollen throat, etc. The sulfites, if present, causes asthma symptoms with shortness of breath and wheezing.
I have had to avoid all corn for my entire life, long before GMOs came to exist. However, I do avoid other GMOs, because any I’ve eaten cause me to have rather serious stomach pains.
When people tell you that they can not safely eat the derivatives of corn or other allergens, believe them. Remember, the real allergy experts are the people who actually ‘have’ the allergies or intolerance. Don’t let the so-called self-appointed experts tell you that we don’t know what we are talking about. We live with, and try to survive these severe allergies, every day of our lives. We do know more then they do… or what they will admit to. Our agenda is staying alive. Not financial profits.
I have never eaten the Wellness meat, so I can’t comment on it. So I am telling it like it is, in general. I’ve eaten other natural beef/meats, that were treated, and had serious reactions.
06/02/2010 at 1:41 am Permalink
I know it is hard to avoid all derivatives of GMO corn, but it becomes very sad when we go out of our way to buy REAL food (which is very pricey) and we still have to deal with those darn GMOs. Very discouraging.
But thank-you Ann Marie for being a detective with this matter. I live in Nebraska so I have access to good quality pasture raised animal products and I will be contacting some of them to see how their cattle are processed. Maybe if enough of us sound the alarm things will start changing.
06/02/2010 at 1:43 am Permalink
Purplehearmom is making sure that the word gets out about USwellnessmeats. It’s on Yahoo Gaps Support, too.
06/02/2010 at 1:48 am Permalink
purpleheartmom – missed the T the first time around
06/02/2010 at 3:03 am Permalink
It seems strange to me that I am being accused of being irresponsible. I waited until I had confirmation from the owner of the company about the use of GMOs before I posted about it, even though I already knew from my reaction that corn was present.
There also seems to be a lot of confusion about my diet. Anyone who is allergic to corn must eat a diet of whole foods cooked from scratch. There is no other way to avoid corn since it is in everything in a box, bag, can, or package. My family eats a further restrictive diet in our efforts to heal the damage done by food additives in our food supply, the GAPS diet. It consists of meat, vegetables, broths, fermented foods, eggs, no grains and no sugar as Ann Marie can tell you since this blog is where I first heard of the GAPS diet.
If everyone here insists on still eating meat treated with lactic acid, then you should know that the highest concentrations of GMOs will be in ground beef, liver sausage and tallow.
kc´s last blog ..GMOs in Pasture Raised Meat
06/02/2010 at 9:35 am Permalink
I have a problem with your blog. The real issue is not whether you believe (or others believe) that small amounts of GMO derived products have no harmful effects. Although since we don’t know much about their effects because our government turns a blind eye and requires no research on the issue, I don’t know why one would assume they are not harmful.
The big issue is that GMO products are so universal that they are even used in the production of organic food which is supposed to be free of genetic modified inputs. I personally am dismayed both at the apparent prevelance (according to you) of the practice of using GMO derived substances in the meat processing and by the acceptance of this practice by you and others on this blog. Frankly, this is exactly why we are facing this problem,. We are far too accepting ot this horrific situation.
If everyone who espouses to care about having healthy, high quality food were to speak loudly against this practice, we would most likely see change. Instead I hear folks saying since it is common, it’s ok. That makes no sense to me. You have the opportunity to make things happen.
Do you believe the ads that tell you that high fructose corn syrup is ok “in moderation”? I don’t and I hope you don’t. They why do you believe the use of lactic acid derived from genetically modified corn is ok? An why do you support its use in processing of organic meat?
06/02/2010 at 10:46 am Permalink
As the mother of a child with a corn allergy I am really glad that kc reported her experiences with Wellness Meats. I had considered buying from them and her post prevented me from spending a lot of money only to have my son get sick. It is very hard to find allergen-free meat that my son doesn’t react to and thanks to kc and cheeseslave’s researches I now know why. Reluctantly I’m going to have to give up on finding “safe” (meaning corn free) mail order beef for my family. Corn truly is everywhere. My family now eats a mostly local, organic, whole foods diet since it’s the only way to avoid our various allergens. This limits our options considerably and it’s disappointing to know that there is wonderful pasture-raised beef out there that my son can’t eat just because of the processing.
For some one who is avoiding GMOs the Wellness meats still sound like a decent choice, especially since it’s a fairly small amount and it’s not like there are many other options. However, for those with an allergy even that tiny amount can cause a reaction. And there’s nothing worse than feeding your child something you think is ok and then seeing them have a bad reaction. Thanks to both of these blog posts for helping me avoid that.
06/02/2010 at 12:01 pm Permalink
KC– I don’t think anyone here is doubting the need for your diet, the seriousness of your allergy or the passion with which you pursue safe food for yourself and your family. However, what you did was blow a minor thing WAY out of proportion, and damaging the reputation of one of the good-guys along the way.
While it is a shame you have become a “canary in the coal mine” for GMO’s, it is also a blessing to the rest of us who cannot detect GM products in the foods we eat. But, for those of us who are not sensitive to the contamination–we have to weigh the matter on a different scale. Yes, lots of things are contaminated. But what can WE choose which is whole, unprocessed, grass-fed, nutritious and beneficial without OBVIOUS GM tainting. US Wellness Meats fits the bill. They did not consciously do anything wrong, yet you penalized them and branded them bad as if they had lied to you. It wasn’t their fault that you didn’t know all the facts about the hows, whys and wherefores of the foods you eat. Perhaps you should have contacted them first, before buying from them?
Additionally, as Anne Marie has gone out of her way to show…the GM contamination–certainly for the rest of us–is so minimal in the lactic acid wash in the first place, and then further removed by processing that it ceases to be an issue of GM contamination at all. Sure we wish there was another source for the stock which the lactic acid wash is made–but how much more cost can US Wellness Meats and other small scale good-guys like them bear and how much more can the consumer bear? As for higher concentrations in the Ground Beef, Tallow and Liverwurst you will have to back that up with a lab test before I believe it. Firstly, if the liver is sprayed at all, then it will have been washed. Secondly, rendering the tallow would help purify any wash remaining. Thirdly, a quality company isn’t going to use the carcass trim from the outside of the animal for it’s grind. There should be no significantly higher concentration of residue in the ground meats than there is on the steaks, etc.
Ours isn’t a matter of insisting on eating meat treated with lactic acid. For the most of us there is no other choice. It is the de facto USDA protocol for all slaughter. I would certainly rather eat meat from US Wellness or a competitor than Tyson, Cargill, or Smithfield…. If we want to eat meat, we have to go with the best choices for each one of us personally. And we need to do the research to make sure we are comfortable with that choice. It is unfair to blame a company for our lack of understanding or research.
And me? I don’t buy commercial meat. Not from US Wellness, not from anyone. I raise my own. I know what it’s been fed, from where and how. I slaughter much of it myself and teach others how to do the same. What I send away for processing or slaughter I do so to small-scale, family operations who I have thoroughly researched. Knowledge is a powerful thing. The only dumb question is the one you do not ask. It can also be the most hurtful question.
Now that this kettle of fish is out in the open and stinks..why don’t we make the best of it. KC–as someone who is so sensitive, why not do something to change how and from what lactic acid washes are made. Work with US Wellness, PURAC, and the FDA. Don’t just give us unsubstantiated problems, give us a path to solutions. You seem to have come up with many solutions in your life so far, now see what you can make happen for everyone’s sake.
06/02/2010 at 12:38 pm Permalink
kc – if the sleepers want to swallow profit-conscious gmo chemicorp pr noise as substantiated fact while invalidating a heath-conscious individual’s personal experience, that is regrettably their level of consciousness. your post was essential. i hope we can parlay this energy into positive change.
sheep and shills for chemicorp – snap out of it. the one expert on here says there is no way to know what remains on the meat. organic labeled meat products are soaked in gmo corn poison. no one is vindicated.
06/02/2010 at 1:18 pm Permalink
I am so sorry that KC had to go through this. Not just the allergic reaction but criticism for enlightening us on US Wellness Meats use of GMO lactic acid spray. When one makes a conscious decision to raise 100% grassfed beef, this should mean from calf to harvest. No matter if a little bit harms me or not, grassfed should mean grassfed. Corn and grassfed, just don’t mesh.
AnnMarie – I love your blog and everything you do to expose our food system, however, I’m disappointed at this. Did Monsanto create this GMO based lactic acid spray. Are we okay with big ag to start spraying our grassfed beef and still fight a good fight against them? I am not criticizing US Wellness Meats for doing this. Large manufacturers have to do this in order to preserve and maintain the spread of e-coli. My point is that US Wellness Meats is a large manufacturer. A far cry from local family farmers that can raise healthy, non GMO grassfed beef.
I buy from a local provider who does not spray with lactic acid of any sort. The beef is hung, never touches another carcass, and sprayed with water. Nothing more.
I know this is a difficult issue, however, this is why it becomes extremely important to support local family farmers. For those of you living in larger urban areas, large cities, it’s time to really get to know who is producing your food. Talk to the farmer, be ensured that they know their own animals and how they were raised from birth to harvest. You really need to stop and think… what is the difference between buying beef covered with cellophane at your grocery store versus buying online. Get to know your producer! Your family and your health depend on it. Trust me, family farmers would love to spend some time chatting about the pride they have in their farms!
Diana@Spain in Iowa´s last blog ..Salsa Roja Para Enchiladas – Red Enchilada Sauce
06/02/2010 at 3:15 pm Permalink
Wow! Isn’t it WONDERFUL that we live in a world where we are free to make choices?!
But, we should make those choices with knowledge. KC chose Grass-Fed Beef because she HAD to, due to her Allergy. Some of us choose corn-fed, some choose pastured beef (out on pasture, with free choice access to corn), and some choose 100% Grass-fed.
I think the main issue that KC (& others) pointed out was CORN in GRASS-fed beef. Those two things should NEVER be combined, ever.
Another issue is to KNOW about your choices. It is no better to hide small details than to hide large details. Corn, in any form, should NEVER be in GRASS-fed beef.
This leads us to other details, how big is your farmer/rancher?
I agree with everything you have pointed out AnneMarie. Scientifically speaking, there should be no effect of the wash for most of us eating US Wellness Meats. Hopefully by knowing the details of both sides, we will all be able to make our own choices.
Thank you for your science and research!! All of us farmers/ranchers love that we can sell our own type of product to people who CHOOSE to research & purchase from us for their own reasons. It is research like yours & kc that will allow all of us to grow!
Thanks!! GreenRanchingMom.blogspot.com
06/02/2010 at 4:07 pm Permalink
Wow. If i ever have a major issue i want you to research it for me! I’m so impressed.
“As much as I empathize with someone who is suffering, I question whether an allergy reaction warrants an attack on a small farm.”
In the same way, i think certain reactions to supplements are not enough to warrant a report to the FDA. Senator McCain is currently advocating legislation which will (reportedly, i’m not sure the bill is available to view yet) bring the supplement industry under the purview of the FDA & required reporting of all adverse reactions, not just those that are severe. My source:
http://www.hawkeshealth.net/community/showthread.php?p=12077#post12077
Kathryn´s last blog ..Surprise!
06/02/2010 at 4:56 pm Permalink
@ Diana
Please go back and actually read the whole post.
PURAC made the spray, not Monsanto. “Big ag” is not spraying the beef. It’s small processors. “Big ag” is washing their beef in ammonia!
And it is not just US Wellness Meats so PLEASE everyone stop making them the bad guys! Many small farmers are using processors that use this particular spray.
Is it ideal? No. In my mind is it OK? Yes, absolutely. I’m OK with it.
After having done the research and making all the calls, I feel that the risk is extremely small. The solution is mostly water and all the exposed flesh is cut away and discarded. How this affects most people eating grass-fed beef, I can’t really see. Perhaps there are SOME people who are super allergic who do react. But most of us are not going to have these experiences.
Diana, how do you know your local beef producer does not spray? Have you actually called their processor? ALL the farmers I called had no idea what their processor was using. We called them and found out that they were using PURAC. It’s possible your farmer has no idea. But they are most likely using something and I’m pretty sure it’s not just water.
Lastly, we ARE talking about small farmers here. US Wellness Meats and Chaffin Family Orchards are both SMALL FARMS. Please stop making them out to be big bad ag producers. They are not. They are my farmers, and they are also my friends.
06/02/2010 at 5:15 pm Permalink
I got a few more details regarding some of these comments. John Wood of US Wellness Meats answered some of my questions via email…
Regarding an alternative to the corn-based lactic acid spray, PURAC does make a sugar-cane-based lactic acid product.
John says:
The lactic acid alternative is made in Thailand from sugar cane. Cost is obviously higher and a much larger carbon footprint.
Regarding using plain water or scalding hot water instead of using a lactic acid solution:
Water has to be super heated to 200 degrees and the carcass has to maintain 160 degree outer layer temp for several minutes in order for the water to do its job. The downsides are the scalding water will blanch and discolor the meat which is not consumer friendly. The goal after slaughter is to immediately chill the carcass which improves the meat and this crazy method heats up which damages meat quality. Lastly, it takes a lot of energy to heat water to 200 degrees which creates extra cost for the final end user.
I asked John if this method of using scalding hot water is essentially like pasteurizing the meat, and he answered:
Yes, and this is nuts for reasons pointed out above.
When I asked John about whether they might want to consider putting some kind of announcement on their website about the fact that corn-allergic individuals may be sensitive, he wrote:
We have sold meat for 10 years to several super sensitive folks and never had an issue. The issue two weeks ago concerning meat balls had more than one ingredient in the recipe. Anyone’s guess what set this off.
He makes a good point. Unless KC was eating nothing but pure ground beef for a period of a few days, how do we know for sure that the reaction was not due to something else? How do we know it wasn’t something her skin came into contact with?
The fact that US Wellness Meats has a track record of over TEN years of selling meat to very sensitive people says a lot.
I think it’s pretty obvious that KC’s experience is an N of 1.
Acc to Wikipedia, “An N of 1 trial is a clinical trial in which a single patient is the entire trial, a single case study.”
Hard to say for sure that the meat caused her reaction, since it was an N of 1, and other factors were involved.
06/02/2010 at 5:46 pm Permalink
Wow, lots of important issues have been brought up here. Thanks again to Ann Marie for tracking things down and following through. Thanks to KC and other sensitive individuals for helping the rest of us understand your issues and also how pervasive GMOs have become in even the organic world.
I have never purchased from US Wellness or any other mail-order meat purveyor, so no one can accuse me of having financial ties or personal interest at stake here. I’m impressed by how forthcoming US Wellness has been and their efforts to find the best solution for their customers, their animals, and the environment, when their choices are constrained by USDA requirements and the available options. This whole issue is indeed a wake-up call to all of us to pay attention to the GMO issue and get politically active over it.
I just want to second the comments others have made that the small, family producers who are trying to do the right thing should not be treated like they’re Monsanto. It sounds like US Wellness is willing to hear the concerns of customers and actually talk to them and answer detailed questions. Ask Percy Schmeiser how far that approach would go with Monsanto.
Unfortunately, it may be that super-sensitive individuals have no choice *at this time* but to find local farmers (even if “local” means a few hours’ drive) to buy from directly. That’s not right, but that may be the situation for some people with extraordinary sensitivity. That doesn’t mean their needs aren’t important, but a business can’t necessarily cater to the particular needs of a few individuals at the expense of serving the vast majority of their customers (if extraordinary measures raise the cost too much for those who don’t need such measures). That balance can be a difficult call to make, and I for one can’t second-guess US Wellness for their choices. It’s not one particular company’s duty to make life simpler for a given customer, but I give them credit for trying. I sympathize with the desire for an explanation and someone to blame for a bad reaction, but as Ann Marie points out, when N=1 it is tricky to interpret the results and their applicability to other situations.
This incident highlights the need for all to start asking more questions about our meat and start creating pressure for better solutions. Let’s just not malign good companies in the process. We should be on the same side.
Jeanmarie´s last blog ..Coconut Ghee, the Perfect Cooking Fat
06/02/2010 at 5:57 pm Permalink
@GreenRanchingMom….This probably isn’t the place to tackle this, but here is as good as anywhere. You are right to a point–Corn, as in the dried kernel, ground into a feed–should not be in beef which is “grass” fed. However, we really need to move away from the term Grass-fed when we are talking about holistically pasture raised, grazed meats. Because in actual fact quite a bit of grains–oats, barley, wheat, and corn–is purposefully grazed by pastured beeves. The key though is these “grains” are grazed before they dry while the milk and nutrition is still in them, and there is plenty of the grassy stalk to be eaten as well. Additionally cattle, sheep and pigs graze turnips and other brassicas. Should they not be called Grass-Fed because of that? Corn has unfortunately become an evil thing everyone is out to demonize, when in fact when eaten whole, or in a pre-processed fashion and from non-gmo sources it is still a great food for humans and animals alike.
Where it goes wrong is in the feedlot, or animal feed mill. Ruminants aren’t meant to handle the *concentrated* amounts of feed–grains, soy, corn, fillers, molasses–which are fed out on non-pastured farms. Just because it says pastured, grass-fed or grazed, do not assume that it has never been fed corn or that by feeding it corn some law or unspoken pact has been broken. The feeding of corn to livestock isn’t wrong. Animals love corn and grains. It is how, like anything we eat as well (corn on the cob is great, but HFCS is evil….), it is consumed and in what quantities. There is a lot of great stuff going on in pastured meat and corn is a part of it.
06/02/2010 at 6:15 pm Permalink
@ Raine
This is off-topic for this particular thread, but I did some more research ire: cod liver oil and prevention of sunburn.
My co-chapter leader here in LA said she didn’t think cod liver oil would prevent sunburn — but that more likely it was an increase in saturated fats in the diet. And yet my in-laws swear that was the only change they made in their diet. They hadn’t really increased their intake of saturated fats but they did notice a marked resistance to sunburn after they started taking the cod liver oil.
I looked around on line and found this:
http://www.seafoodfromnorway.com/page?id=100&key=11926
Cod liver oil has high levels of omega 3 fatty acids — so maybe that’s what it is that helps to prevent sunburn. So many of us have way more omega 6s and not enough omega 3s in our diet, due to meat/milk/cheese/eggs we consume from corn/soy fed cows and chickens. Anyway, just speculation — I’m not a nutrition expert — but I thought this was interesting.
Interesting too because we were eating fish and seafood 2-3 times per day in Hawaii, plus our cod liver oil.
06/02/2010 at 6:32 pm Permalink
One question I have is whether US Wellness Meats cuts off the lactic acid treated part of the carcas or processes it? It seems from Annmarie’s research either could happen. Chaffin does this, but Chris did mention that some producers do not. I would be curious what US Welnness Meats practice is (or really – the practice of their processor).
06/02/2010 at 6:46 pm Permalink
The major problem for people who are allergic to corn is that there is usually nothing on food labels to warn us that the product contains corn. It is never labeled when corn derivatives are used for processing and packaging of foods. This includes fresh meat, as well as produce. And there are a zillion additives and other substances that are made from corn, but not anything to warn us on labels. Most people don’t realize that citric acid, lactic acid and many others are made from corn, wet-milled by soaking in sulfites in a lot of cases. And, many times we are given the wrong information when we call or e-mail customer service people.
Corn allergy is very common, but ignored by the food industry, FAAN, FDA, USDA and many others. Reason is, that corn and waste from the corn industries are dumped into most of the food supply, as well as non-food items. So, the-powers-that-be claims that corn allergy is extremely rare, to non-existent. The corn lobby and food industries are very powerful, and corn allergic people are not. FAAN has Monsanto people on their board, and takes funding from them, Kraft and other food industry giants. A google search will give information about that. And the book ‘The Unhealthy Truth’ has a lot more about the situation. It is well worth reading, even for people without food allergies.
If food labels listed all ingredients, and what is used in processing and packaging, it would lessen our risks of unknowingly eating a food allergen that can cause severe allergic reactions, as well as ending our lives. I have had anaphylaxis several times, from eating hidden corn in a food that was supposed to be safe for me. I’m sure that everyone has heard of a child dying from a trace of hidden peanut, milk, egg or other allergen that was in a food product. This also can apply to corn and other allergens that are not among the ‘Big Eight’ foods that FAAN and the FDA will allow to be called allergens, and labeled. The rest of us are SOOL!
This also applies to sulfites that are used for processing and packaging of foods. And companies don’t need to label them, unless they actually put them in their products. And only if it is over a set amount. Unfortunately, they don’t need to be labeled if used by their suppliers in any amount. Not good news for people allergic to sulfites, and asthmatics, when even trace amounts of hidden sulfites can cause severe reactions.
The corn and sulfites in meat treatments are a serious health hazard for many of us. It would be great if food companies would take us seriously and label all the ingredients and what they are made from, in their products and packaging. But sadly, this is not going to happen, despite our many pleas for help. They don’t want to be bothered, I guess.
Corn is a member of the grass/cereal family. One of the most allergenic botanical families on the planet. So, why is corn allergy ignored? Follow the money trail, and that tells the story.
06/02/2010 at 7:29 pm Permalink
“I also spoke to Chris Kerston at Chaffin. Chris is extremely knowledgeable about sustainable farming. He told me that the lactic acid spray was standard. ”
This is an interesting statement. I just ordered a half a pig from a long time and very reputable butcher. I specifically asked if they sprayed their meat with anything beside just plain old water. She asked in a very confused voice “Yes, we just spray the carcass with water what else would we use?” I mentioned to her lactic acid. She said why would they do that when water works just fine.
If you want to spray the meat with stuff go for it. But, please let the consumer know what you are putting on the meat because I for one will not buy it if you do.
Did you look at this site?
http://www.meatinternational.com/research/meat-safety/treatments-using-hot-water-instead-of-lactic-acid-reduce-levels-of-aerobic-bacteria-and-enterobacteriaceae-and-reduce-the-prevalence-of-escherichia-coli-o157-h7-on-preevisceration-beef-carcasses%86-id27.html
06/02/2010 at 8:28 pm Permalink
@ J
When I spoke to Kerston, I believe he said that there are only 2 processing plants in all of northern California that will take smaller farmers on (and harvest fewer steers). They don’t have a lot of choice.
Did your butcher, the one you called, actually process the meat from the beginning to end? If not, she may not even know what happens. We’re not talking about the butcher who cuts up the meat. We’re talking about the “harvester” who initially harvests the animal and removes the hide.
06/02/2010 at 8:32 pm Permalink
@Podchef
I won’t take offense to your post, because you obviously haven’t read my blog, or you didn’t really think about my “name”.
I totally agree that the term “Pastured Beef” is much better. That’s why we sell Pastured Beef! We raise most of our cattle out on grass with access to free choice grains on a daily basis. Technically speaking a “Grass-fed” animal should only be fed forages. Meaning only the plant, not the mature seeds of a plant.
We totally disagree in our house about how to finish an animal, and many cattlemen do disagree about the benefits of corn-finishing an animal. Because of this, we do corn-finish some select animals (including those WE eat). And you’re right, animals love their corn (candy).
What I had an issue with is the MIS-LABELING. CORN should never be in 100% GRASS-fed animals in ANY form. We are very careful on our ranch to specify, Pasture Beef from Grass-Fed Beef. Because people like KC, may have specific reasons for choosing Grass-Fed Beef.
I do appreciate your help to inform others that corn is not evil. Corn will help develop an animal quicker and thus promote tenderness & flavor. Some, like my husband, will even go so far as to say that corn makes a better flavor.
Just like everything in America, we have WONDERFUL CHOICES!!!
@Cheeseslave I am Diana’s producer for 100% Grass-Fed Beef. She recieved one of our select 100% Grass-Fed animals this year. Our local processor does NOT use any artificial sprays. I personally have traveled the entire process with our beef to ensure I know EXACTLY how our animals are handled. I am now trying another local locker & am learning their entire process, BEFORE I will sell this beef with any special labels.
What is the difference between BIG AG & BIGGER AG? What “IS” Big AG, and who defines these things. I know that SMALL AG is one family, like ours.
I APPLAUD US Wellness Meats, they started as a small family ranch & now provide beef to countless families across the states!
GreenRanchingMom´s last blog ..We Show BREEDING Cattle, We don’t raise Show Cattle
06/02/2010 at 8:40 pm Permalink
@ GreenRanchingMom
Thanks for your comments. Very helpful.
What spray does your processor use? I heard from one animal vet who spoke to his processor — he was told that the USDA requires some kind of spray — otherwise they have to use ammonia or the scalding hot water.
Another processor I spoke to said that sometimes vinegar is used, but he said something about how it can mess up the refrigerator coils so they don’t use it.
06/02/2010 at 8:42 pm Permalink
@ GreenRanchingMom
BTW when I first called Carole at Chaffin, her first response was, “No, they don’t spray anyting on the animals.” She was sure of it. Then she called their processor and found out that they do use the lactic acid spray. Everyone I spoke with used SOME kind of spray.
06/02/2010 at 10:46 pm Permalink
It’s essential to understand in this discussion about sprays that there is a big difference between “custom” processors, who handle animals that are sold to customers “on the hoof” and butchered for them only (or the group of people they are splitting the meat with as many people do) and USDA-inspected processors who can butcher meat for retail sale. Custom processors do not have to be USDA-inspected or follow rules about using anti-bacterial spray or the super-heated water. They can just spray the carcass off with some hot water.
There was a question about KC’s assertion that liverwurst/liver sausage would be more contaminated with this spray than other meats. Liverwurst contains more than liver, in fact, it’s usually only 20-30% liver and the rest is *ground* pork and fat. It is the ground portion that is most likely to get contaminated with the spray, as much of the ground comes from trimmings that were once part of the exterior aspect of the carcass.
Ann Marie, to answer your question about liverwurst–you can make it with just about anything. Getting the lean:fat ratio matters a bit, but I found that 1 part liver:1 part sausage:1/2 part lean (the heart) worked well. I’m going to try it with a pork chop instead of heart next.
Finally, I don’t think we have to live in a bubble to avoid GM products. In fact, getting out into the fresh air, visiting farmers markets and farms is probably one of the best ways to avoid frankenfoods. The lesson in this, I believe, is that while for those who truly cannot access grassfed meat locally (by the way, “our” local farm is 100 miles away, but we by most of our beef and pork once a year), a large operation like US Wellness may be the only option, though it is a problematic one because it must follow USDA rules. Buying whole animals from local farmers (or splitting one with a group of friends) allows you to avoid the USDA regs *and* gets you in touch with the whole animal. There are cuts in my freezer that I never would have purchased from the butchershop where I used to buy meat. Maybe buying a whole, local animal even pushes you to make your own liverwurst, just the way you like it.
Chris at Lost Arts Kitchen´s last blog ..When Life Hands You Liver…
06/02/2010 at 11:15 pm Permalink
@ Chris
Good point about custom processors.
Re: the ground beef and liverwurst having more of the lactic acid residue — you wrote:
“much of the ground comes from trimmings that were once part of the exterior aspect of the carcass.”
Two different processors said they do not use the “trimmings” that are part of the exterior. Again, the part that is sprayed is totally cut away and discarded, at least in the case of USWM & Chaffin. Some of the other bigger processors probably do use the trimmings — it would depend upon the individual processor.
To repeat again, Chaffin’s processor uses the spray, and they are a small local farm. So the solution is NOT to simply go w/ a local farm. USWM is no different from thousands of other small family farms out there who are selling local grass-fed beef. Many of these processors are using this spray.
Again, I personally don’t think this issue of the spray is an issue for most people. Even Sally Fallon Morell did not seem concerned about it. And Jeffrey Smith did not say that the risks are great. He said he can’t say what the risks are but he also didn’t say he was concerned about it.
And I still question if it even was the meat that made KC have a reaction. We just don’t know.
06/02/2010 at 11:26 pm Permalink
Hi AnnMarie, I did read the entire article, yours as well as KC’s.
I know Monsanto did not make the spray, but the corn that Purac uses to create their sprays is from the Midwest, Genetically Modified, and trickles down the line straight into Monsanto’s lap. Big Ag is washing their cut beef in ammonia after the carcass has been sprayed by Purac.
I’m not here to argue at all. I commend you for all the phone calls you put into this. I’m honestly glad this subject has been opened and called to attention. You know, whenever these precautionary steps are taken to preserve and eliminate bacteria, I always turn to see what Europe is doing. My family being from Spain, I see the complete difference their country has in doing what’s best for their people, versus the American $. In Europe, this treatment is not approved (yet). For a few reasons.
1. Purac uses GMO corn.
2. Their hasn’t been substantial evidence that spraying with a lactic acid solution or any other solution at significantly reducing microbial contamination.
3. Possibility of microorganisms developing resistance to such substances as a result of their use.
Their is still a lot more research I want to do on this subject including calling many family farmers and lockers throughout Iowa. I by no means am calling US Wellness Meats Big Ag! There are other solutions. It’s difficult though, and I understand that. Especially for small farmers without a huge amount of cash flow. I do empathize for US Wellness, however, as a sponsor of not only the Real Food Media Blog Network, but the Weston Price Foundation, I would assume more thought would have went into spraying any animal with a genetically modified organism. I know, you mentioned that once the lactic acid is made that the GMO is non-detectable. But for me it comes down to this, an organic or grassfed based farmer is spending money on a company who produces their lactic acid wash. That company in order to make their lactic acid wash buys some GMO seeds from the midwest. Wow.. Monsanto really does own all Food.
Here’s an idea.. how about seeds made from open pollinated corn? Or better yet, if Europe can wash their animals without a chemical wash, why can’t we? Something new to fight for!!
Diana@Spain in Iowa´s last blog ..Salsa Roja Para Enchiladas – Red Enchilada Sauce
07/02/2010 at 12:01 am Permalink
@ Jessie
The processor for US Wellness Meats cuts off all the meat that has been sprayed.
07/02/2010 at 12:15 am Permalink
@ Diana
I think it’s a stretch to say that Monsanto owns all food. I think they are a big impact and what they do does ripple out and affect a lot of the food supply. But they don’t “own all food”.
Remember, this lactic acid solution is only 2% lactic acid and 98% water.
For those of us who drink water or iced tea or beer or wine or soda or other drinks made with water — or even canned beans or store-bought chicken broth or any number of other products that are produced with water — we are often taking in fluoride, and often other industrial waste products like rocket fuel (perchlorate):
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/09/22/tech/main4470126.shtml
My point is, as healthy and as a producer of food tries to be, they can’t avoid some things. This is why I ask you all to please not blame the small farmer. Take this to the government. If you are mad about GMOs and other toxins in our environment, speak out against the government — the USDA, FDA and other governmental agencies.
This is what organizations like the Weston A. Price Foundation and the Farm to Consumer Foundation and the Institute for Responsible Technology (Jeffrey Smith’s non-profit org) and the Cornucopia Institute do EVERY DAY. They are out there, working for peanuts, fighting the government to get them out of bed with these corporations like Monsanto, Cargill, and ADM.
Instead of attacking USWM and other small farmers who are actually doing GOOD and working night and day and breaking their backs to produce healthy food for us (John Wood, as far as I can tell, does not even sleep!) why aren’t we directing our energies to fight the REAL enemy? Why aren’t we going and donating money to Jeffrey Smith’s organization and WAPF and Cornucopia? Why aren’t we volunteering our time? We aren’t we writing posts about them and doing interviews? Why aren’t we doing email campaigns and posting on Facebook?
Are you all members of the WAPF? Are you all donating to the Cornucopia Institute? Are you members of the Farm to Consumer Foundation? Have you donated to the Institute for Responsible Technology?
These are the people fighting for us. If we are not donating to their organizations every year and doing everything we can to support them, what right do we have to complain?
As far as using a water-only wash, please read the comments above. In order to do that, they have to use scalding hot (160-200 degree) water. All the European meat is treated this way. Not a solution for the reasons John lists above in the comments.
07/02/2010 at 12:23 am Permalink
One more thing. If we don’t support our small farmers and stand behind them and support them, how can we expect to create a food revolution in this country and around the world?
Instead of sitting around complaining about what’s wrong with our food supply, why aren’t we out doing something about it? Our farmers are already doing everything they can to help create change.
What are YOU doing?
Here are the links to go and support these organizations who are working to protect our food supply. Please use your energy to go and donate or volunteer your time.
Weston A Price Foundation: http://www.westonaprice.org/Become-a-member.html
Institute for Responsible Technology (fighting GMOs): http://www.responsibletechnology.org/GMFree/Donate/index.cfm
Cornucopia Institute: https://app.etapestry.com/hosted/TheCornucopiaInstitute/OnlineGiving.html
Farm to Consumer Foundation: http://www.farmtoconsumerfoundation.org/donations.php
07/02/2010 at 1:50 am Permalink
When I first contacted Mr. Wood about this issue, he seemed genuinely concerned with getting to the bottom of the meat processing procedure. I felt that once he found out the facts, he would seek alternatives to using GMO sprays. I told him that I would have to go back to everyone that I recommended USWM as a corn-free meat source and warn them. I write a blog about avoiding corn so I must warn others of hidden sources of corn, EVEN IF IT COSTS ME A SPONSOR. I soon realized that he was going on the defensive and standing by this use of GMOs sprays as “standard”. He was also enlisting forces to back him up in his decision. Heavy hitters like Cheeseslave and Sally Fallon Morell would be contributing to the defense of this practice. Gone was the hope that this statement from his email gave me, “We are planning to build our own fabrication and cold storage facility this Spring. We will have complete control over meat fabrication. Once we master this piece of the business we are considering the slaughter piece of the business so we can control all aspects of the business.”
Sally Fallon Morell, founding president of The Weston A. Price Foundation, was contacted for a statement and said, “I have no problems with the lactic acid treatment — sounds quite natural.”.
Ann Marie, you previously stated on this same blog, “Because the reality is, most people don’t even know they are eating GMOs. They don’t know GMOs are in their breakfast cereal and their baby’s formula. They don’t know GMOs are in their cookies and in their milk. And they don’t know about the health risks. They don’t know about the environmental threat.
We need to raise awareness. We need to educate. Those of us who do know, we need to shout it from the rooftops. Like Horton in Horton Hears a Who.
Because if we don’t speak out, we won’t have organic food. It will be contaminated by the ever-growing number of GM crops. If we don’t speak out, we won’t have small family farms. They’ll be put out of business by corporations like Monsanto.”
Are these really the people that are fighting for us? There was a very clear choice to be made here and I feel that you all made the wrong one. US Wellness clearly will not be looking for alternatives when they gain complete control over meat fabrication because they find nothing wrong with the present practice. This whole blog post was to convince CONSUMERS not to find anything wrong with it, either. It sounds like the Weston A. Price Foundation won’t bother to fight GMOs as long as the use of the GMO sprays “sounds natural”. Ann Marie, it appears that you think GMOs are dangerous except when used by your sponsors. Not only will you guys not be fighting for change, but you spent a lot of time and effort to demonize “Horton” instead. I believe obfuscation and attacking the credibility of the whistleblower are Monsanto’s favorite tactics as well.
kc´s last blog ..GMOs in Pasture Raised Meat
07/02/2010 at 3:29 am Permalink
The only problem I have with said company, is that they finish all their very expensive poultry on soy and corn.
I do not know about the beef and pork though…..
It only takes 5 days to undue all that good grass fed meat with grain.
Paula
Paula Runyan´s last blog ..Energy Efficient slow cooking
07/02/2010 at 11:25 am Permalink
Thank you so much for raising my awareness on these issues. I feel so much more fortunate and thankful that I’ve been able to buy my meat directly from friends or friends of friends and either have it processed by them or custom processed by a local processor and follow “my animal” so closely. In fact, the pelt of the last goat I ordered is still in the freezer and going to be shipped to the tanner tomorrow! (I picked up the pelt mere hours after the live animal was delivered and picked up my custom cuts a couple of days later.)
Anyway, to get back on point… my question here is this: I looked at the US Wellness site and it doesn’t indicate what part of the animal the ground beef comes from. I admit I’m not that educated about such things as the last time I purchased ground meat it was from a friend and we ground the meat of the animal she slaughtered in her kitchen so I knew where it was from and there were no unanswered questions. SO… if one were to have problems from the ground beef from US Wellness Meats, is it possible that one would have problems from any meat from US Wellness Meats — or any processor or retailer actually when it comes right down to it, I guess — because the meat could be ground from any of the meat from the animal? Is the ground beef limited to certain parts of the animal that could possibly be *more* exposed than others to the lactic acid wash? I’m honestly not saying this to be critical of anyone at all, but more so to try to educate all of us here on the topic.
Thank you so much!!
07/02/2010 at 3:05 pm Permalink
@ KC
I have great empathy for your suffering. And I deeply appreciate your conviction to uphold standards and support healthy food, and to fight genetically modified organisms. I stand with you in this commitment.
I have purposefully not responded to you and your comments because I don’t want this to devolve into an argument. I tried to write an objective counter to your blog post. I tried to provide more insight into what was happening, based on real information I gathered from knowledgeable individuals.
I must challenge your arguments, however. Your logic is deeply flawed, mainly due to a lack of evidence.
You have insinuated more than once that I have taken the stand I have because USWM is a sponsor. Let it be known, John Wood never asked me to write this post. I chose to write it. To insinuate that where I stand politically is influenced by who pays me is also not only presumptuous but wholly incorrect.
The truth is, I walked away from a six-figure salary to run Real Food Media. Just before I started this company, I was working as a new media consultant, billing out at $125 per hour. I earned $10-20K per month prior to this (depending on how many hours I chose to work). I now pay myself less than $5 per hour. You can do the math and figure out how much I make now.
I have spent over a year building this blog network, working, on average, 12-16 hours per day on weekdays and I typically work 4-8 hours every weekend day. I put my daughter into daycare so I can do this. Am I crazy? Maybe. But I am also very passionate about what I believe in and feel that I must do this. It is my way of making a difference in the world.
If I wanted to make money, I certainly would not be doing this business. If I wanted to have a LIFE, I would not be doing this. I’d go back to corporate advertising. Or I’d create a blog network around food or any other number of verticals. I’d take sponsorship dollars from anyone who asked, and put soy milk ads all over the place.
The truth is, I’ve turned away most of the advertisers who have contacted me. Because we do have standards and we are trying to do something different here. We have attracted a highly targeted audience who are looking for very specific kinds of products. Small farmers don’t have a lot of money to spend on advertising. Nor do small artisanal bread bakers. Monsanto has money. Cargill has money. Nestle has money. Nestle was one of my former sponsors at my old corporate advertising job.
Those of us who have jumped ship from Corporate America and are doing what we believe is right are taking HUGE risks. Not just financial risks. It also takes guts and courage to stand up for what you believe in.
It does not take guts to write scathing blog posts attacking small farmers. That’s easy to do from the comfort of your own home, in relative anonymity. You can call yourself “KC”, put up a free blog, and say whatever you want. What does that cost you in time, in money, in reputation? Zilch. What does it cost small farmers who, as I said, break their backs and work insane amounts of hours for very little money for TEN years to build their reputation with their customers? It’s very damaging to them.
This is why I felt the need to write a blog post countering yours. Honestly, I would not have even noticed your blog post if you had not gone out of your way to post it on the Real Food Wednesday blog carnival and on the Nourishing Gourmet blog. And I would have written this blog post whether US Wellness Meats was a sponsor or not.
Now, if you had written a factual, objective blog post, it would have been different. I would have respected that. If you had spent the time making calls and send emails to farmers and processors and other experts in the field. If you had real hard evidence that the meat did cause your allergic reaction. If you had actually looked into it prior to posting, you would have seen that many other small farmers use this same lactic acid spray. An objectively written post would have not singled out one small farm.
If you had done your research you would have found out that John Wood was right when he said that he supposes that these sprays are pretty standard. That’s what I found out too, based on the people I have spoken to so far. I could spend more time researching this, but to be honest, I don’t make any money writing blog posts and I have a million other things I need to be working on so I can grow my business and actually make a living. For me to take a few days out of my life to do this is difficult, as I am already overburdened. But I felt that it was important to set the record straight.
And John did not contact Sally. I did. John did not contact Jeffrey Smith. I did. John did not even enlist me, as I stated above. He asked for nothing. I chose to do this.
As far as what USWM plans to do in the future regarding their meat harvesting, how do you know that he is not still planning to build a cold storage facility? Did he actually say that or put it in writing? To imply that he is not still working on that is baseless, something you’ve made up out of thin air. Nothing gets my goat like a lack of logic. Logical thinking and critical reasoning requires evidence.
The last paragraph of your comment is riddled with more baseless claims:
“US Wellness clearly will not be looking for alternatives when they gain complete control over meat fabrication because they find nothing wrong with the present practice.”
Again — no evidence of this. Get a statement from USWM supporting this — otherwise, we can toss it in the bin as total fabrication.
“This whole blog post was to convince CONSUMERS not to find anything wrong with it, either.”
I’ve already gone into great detail about how little money I make. I can make literally TWENTY times more money in my old position working with sponsors I don’t believe in. As I said, I have turned away more sponsors than I have brought on. I could double or triple our revenue within a matter of weeks if I simply let anyone advertise. If your position were correct, if I were motivated by money, I would simply ditch sponsors like USWM and solicit Horizon and run their SILK Soy Milk ads. Or anyone who wanted to advertise with us for that matter.
If I had found that your claims against small farms like USWM had merit and were rooted in truth, I would have published that. That was not my conclusion. Do you think I’m lying? Why wouldn’t I just have talked to USWM and asked them to switch their processing methods? I didn’t do that because I truly believe that, while it is not ideal to use the lactic acid, it’s not a risk for most people.
And I am still not convinced that the meat caused your allergic reaction. I’m not saying you are wrong. I just don’t know what caused it and I don’t think you have provided adequate evidence that USWM causes corn-allergic people to react.
“It sounds like the Weston A. Price Foundation won’t bother to fight GMOs as long as the use of the GMO sprays “sounds natural”.”
Please provide some proof that the WAPF “won’t bother” to fight GMOs. Have you any idea how much work they have done to educate people about the dangers of GMOs? You might want to look into that before you blame them for not fighting against GMOs.
“Ann Marie, it appears that you think GMOs are dangerous except when used by your sponsors.”
See above re: sponsorship and this business model. You are alleging that I am making editorial decisions based on sponsorship dollars. You have no evidence of that.
Further, this issue is not as black and white as you have made it out to be. The blog post I wrote reflects that. The solution is only 2% lactic acid and 98% water. The meat that is sprayed is cut away and discarded. Acc. to Jeffrey Smith, GMO expert, the risk is minimized with each of these steps.
Is it perfect? No. Are all foods we support perfect? NO.
Sally Fallon Morell told the audience at the last WAPF conference that she herself cannot find soy-free eggs. She has also told people on countless occasions to do the best they can, based on their own circumstances. I believe USWM and the other small farmers using this lactic acid spray are doing the best they can based on the circumstances.
“Not only will you guys not be fighting for change, but you spent a lot of time and effort to demonize “Horton” instead. I believe obfuscation and attacking the credibility of the whistleblower are Monsanto’s favorite tactics as well.”
Another baseless argument. How can you make the claim that we are not fighting for change? Evidence, please?
And I never attacked your credibility. THat’s a logical fallacy called “ad hominem”. If I had said, “What does this lady know? She’s just a homemaker.” Or whatever. But I know nothing about you, nor did I ever attack you personally.
I attacked your logic, plain and simple. You just didn’t provide evidence to support your position. Lack of evidence = no logic.
KC, I wish you the best and pray for your health. I hope that in the future, you will choose to use your energy to help us fight against toxic food additives and promote healthy farm-fresh food, instead of fighting the good guys who are doing their best. Please consider that we are all just doing the best we can.
07/02/2010 at 3:48 pm Permalink
cheeseslave
kc’s post warned people that uswm is sprayed with gmo corn based lactic acid and that she reacted to it in ground beef. she confirmed with john at uswm before posting.
fact: uswm meat is sprayed with gmo corn derived lactic acid.
fact: kc believes she reacted to it.
there is nothing wrong with that post. it would be irresponsible not to share it on the corn free forum or anywhere else she likes.
where is your “evidence” that the lactic acid solution is 2%? that the gray part is cut off? that no gmo dna remains in the fermented end product?
someone told you that stuff. someone told you they reacted. all hearsay, but you
you treat the info you like as substantiated fact while attacking kc’s credibility to report her OWN PERSONAL EXPERIENCE?
i see a lot of hypocrisy and no credibility.
07/02/2010 at 3:59 pm Permalink
It seems to me that if the gray part resulting from the 2% lactic acid solution wasn’t removed, that customers would have gray meat, no? Or am I not following correctly? Also, I’m just wondering if all of their cuts would be affecting by it if it weren’t appreciably deteriorated.
Getting “perfect food” is extremely difficult even when you “grow your own.” We recently got pet chickens and the search for soy-free organic chicken feed was a difficult one. Even now that I’ve located it, it has more corn than I would like and I “supplement” with other things. My friends who have farms and “grow their own” also struggle with how to find ideal foods, how to rotate pasture, how to create the ideal soil environment, etc. … and while I identify and empathize with people with food challenges, I also empathize with those who struggle to provide ideal foods to meet the demand for them. Utilizing opportunities like these as ones for both sides to have a “meeting of the minds” and educate each other would be a very rich opportunity out of which a lot of good things could come.
07/02/2010 at 4:12 pm Permalink
@ riixx
“kc’s post warned people that uswm is sprayed with gmo corn based lactic acid and that she reacted to it in ground beef. she confirmed with john at uswm before posting.”
Part of that statement is true.
“kc’s post warned people that uswm is sprayed with gmo corn based lactic acid”
True.
“and that she reacted to it in ground beef.”
Not substantiated.
“fact: uswm meat is sprayed with gmo corn derived lactic acid.”
Agreed.
However, many other brands of grass-fed beef are also sprayed with this lactic acid. To single out USWM is misleading.
“fact: kc believes she reacted to it.”
A belief is not a fact.
As much as I like to believe that I can fly, until I can prove that I can, it’s only a belief and not a fact.
“there is nothing wrong with that post. it would be irresponsible not to share it on the corn free forum or anywhere else she likes.”
It is just not based on fact.
“where is your “evidence” that the lactic acid solution is 2%? that the gray part is cut off? that no gmo dna remains in the fermented end product?”
That fact came from Chris Johansen, the processor in Northern California. Feel free to call him yourself:
http://ucce.ucdavis.edu/datastore/datastoreview/showpage.cfm?usernumber=2&surveynumber=223
You can also call PURAC, as I did.
“someone told you that stuff.”
They didn’t make it up out of thin air. It’s documented fact. Now, I didn’t *see* a document stating that the lactic acid solution was 98% water.
Honestly, I didn’t have tons of time to get this post up and I had already spent enough time. But yeah, I am sure I could go and pull up that document somewhere and produce it.
“someone told you they reacted.”
She reacted, and I don’t doubt that, we just don’t know if it was the meat that caused it.
“all hearsay, but you you treat the info you like as substantiated fact while attacking kc’s credibility to report her OWN PERSONAL EXPERIENCE?”
I never attacked her credibility. She attacked mine by insinuating that I wrote the post because I am motivated by money.
But I did not attack her credibility Read my comment again. I only attacked her logic.
07/02/2010 at 4:36 pm Permalink
so i have this straight
statements from kc are not based on fact
statements from PURAC are based on fact
what exactly constitutes a fact to you?
07/02/2010 at 5:27 pm Permalink
KC writes on GAPS support that she is now getting meat from another source. KC, are you 100% sure that the meat you’re now getting is free from GM corn? Did you personally see the animal at harvest or when it was processed? Or did you call and ask them?
I know how frustrating it can be on GAPS diet to make sure you’re getting the cleanest sources of food for yourself and your little ones. I am doing the same. I am hopeful that you have found meat that works for you and your family. I don’t think USWM did anything wrong, though. They NEVER lied to you about GM corn spray. It seems like standard practice.
I will still buy from USWM but I will also experiment with making my own liverwurst and head cheese from my own source of local organic, grass-fed beef. I guess I’m not crazy about the possibility of GM corn in my expensive meat, either. But I still respect and will buy from US Wellness Meats.
07/02/2010 at 5:40 pm Permalink
I should mention that I will see what my farm using as a spray when their cows are harvested. It might very well be what is used by USWM. We will see…
07/02/2010 at 6:36 pm Permalink
I’ve been thinking about this subject for days, and have gone back and forth. I love this blog, and do not doubt Ann Marie’s committment to fighting the real food cause at all. Nor do I think she’s doing any of this for money. I don’t doubt the backbreaking work that USWM farmers put into producing quality food either. The fact, as we all know, is that GMO’s are insidious in this country. It is extremely difficult to avoid them entirely (thanks Monsanto, USDA and FDA)!
I am thankful for all the time and research Ann Marie put into discovering the deatails of the lactic acid practice. I had no idea to even question the processing of my local grass fed beef, and will definitely do so now. Thanks to the research here, I feel educated enough to do so, and know what questions to ask.
That being said, I am somewhat disappointed in certain aspects of this post as well. I think the title is condesceding to kc. The word “allege” implies that she is making a claim without proof to back it up. However she did have proof, from the owner of USWM, that GM corn derived lactic acid spray is used on the grass fed beef, before she posted. The bottom line is that her allegation is true. This practice is NOT ok with me, period!
My hope is now that USWM is aware of this problem, they will take steps to eradicate GMO spray from their business practices. As others have pointed out above, there are other, more effective alternatives to the spray. I would rather have a little damaged and discolored meat from the scalding water treatment than GM spray on my meat. Couldn’t this part be cut away as well? I understand this will not happen immediately, but I hope it does happen in time. In my opinion, the first step to solving a problem is becoming aware that there is a problem. So now everyone knows.
I also think it’s insulting to question kc’s belief that her family’s reaction to the meatballs might not have been caused by the GMO corn contaminated beef. There were 5 ingredients in the meatballs, 4 of which she had already been using and knew were safe for her family to consume. That is a logical conclusion in my book.
I thank both kc and Ann Marie for raising and investigating this issue to the benefit of all who read, and seek real food for their families. Change will never happen unless consumers demand it.
07/02/2010 at 6:44 pm Permalink
I guess the companies that produce food and other products can use anything they want in their products. They own the companies, and call the shots.
However, I feel they should have a responsibility to label everything that is in their products, to warn people with allergies/asthma and intolerance that the foods or products are not safe for them. Any food or food/chemical additives can cause severe reactions in susceptible people. This does include processing and packaging aids. Unfortunately, people who run these companies don’t really grasp how serious the situation is, for people who have food issues. Or, they just don’t care. In many cases, they really don’t know what is actually in their products from their outside suppliers. Or what the gazillion additives are made from. Hint, usually corn.
People who have food allergies and are trying a new food or product for the first time, will not eat any other unknown or unproven foods at the same time. So, we actually can tell exactly what food has caused our reactions. Those of us who have really severe allergies and asthma must do this, because our lives depend on it. So to claim that we don’t know what we reacted to is not a valid argument, that is used against the person with the severe allergic reaction. We know what we are doing. Outsiders, don’t have a clue. And obviously, they refuse to take us seriously. This is a common problem for us, and very difficult to overcome.
The bottom line is, use whatever you want in your products, but use labels to inform us what else is hidden in foods that appear to be safe for us. Leaving hidden ingredients and processing/packaging aids off labels, is very misleading, to say the least, and a severe health risk for many of us.
Donnie
Severe allergies to all corn and derivatives, sulfites. Has Celiac and asthma.
07/02/2010 at 7:57 pm Permalink
@ Jen
Thanks for your thoughtful comment.
Please note: there is nothing “condescending” about the word allege. According to Merriam-Webster, an allegation is simply “a positive assertion; specifically: a statement by a party to a legal action of what the party undertakes to prove”. It also has the definition of “an assertion unsupported and by implication regarded as unsupportable”.
I believe it is true that the carcasses were sprayed with lactic acid, and I agree it is true that KC had an allergic reaction. Whether it was the meat, we do not know for sure. How can we? What else did she eat that day? What did she eat the day before? What did she come in contact with other than food? It’s too hard to say for sure.
Now, if this had happened to 5 other people, I’d say that’s more compelling evidence.
I don’t think it’s “insulting” to question her claim. I would just like to see more evidence.
Likewise, if I made the claim that US Wellness Meats is absolutely safe (which I have not), you would also expect me to back up that claim. I simply made the claim that I feel it’s safe for me and I will continue to buy it.
Everyone needs to make choices that are right for them. Some people who have severe allergies may react to it. Perhaps that is true. In which case, they will have to go to greater lengths to find food that is safe for them to eat.
I still do not feel that this justifies attacking a small farm and portraying them as though they did something wrong. I just can’t see how that is fair.
07/02/2010 at 11:10 pm Permalink
@ KC
I am amazed that someone could have such severe allergies that they could react so severely to such a miniscule amount of corn. Whether or not the meat was the source of the corn, my heart goes out to you, that you have to be SO vigilent in protecting yourself and your children from corn, which is in so MUCH of the American food supply. This is not normal, and may be a sign that your body (and those of your children) could really benefit from some extra help. Diet alone may not be enough to heal these allergies, and if it is, it will take a loooooong time. Maybe you can handle the hassle now, but can you maintain this “watchdog” approach to eating for the next ten years? fifteen? thirty? It’s exhausting to think about! My children and I are on GAPS too, and while it’s helped us a lot, we’ve also greatly benefitted from the addition of some healing herbs. Dr. Christopher’s herbal blends are wildcrafted and pure, and there are some formulas designed to settle down the immune system for people with allergies. It might be worth looking into. (By the way, I don’t sell them or anything, so I don’t recommend them for financial gain or anything like that. They’ve just helped us a lot. I’m sure there are also other good brands of herbs. Dr. Christopher was a pioneer in the 1940’s in the herbal field and did some amazing work.) I wholeheartedly believe in Weston A Price “style” eating, in GAPS, in avoiding GMO’s, etc., but what I really love is the freedom to enjoy all kinds of good food and not live in fear of every bite I put in my mouth. The body was designed to be able to handle small amounts of toxins. If it wasn’t, the population would die out very quickly! As long as we eat well 80% of the time our bodies should be able to handle limited amounts of toxins. And aren’t we all doing this so we can heal? I know I am! I hope that even small farms would be inspired to change their practices, if necessary, for the better… but I pray that you and your family would find healing so you can enjoy freedom and relief. Best wishes!
07/02/2010 at 11:31 pm Permalink
@ Kaylin
What a helpful comment! My heart also goes out to KC and the others who are so allergic to corn. I can only imagine how hard it would be.
In addition to GAPS, I have also read about people having great success with detoxification regimes like coffee enemas and epsom salt baths. Both Dr. Campbell McBride and Dr. Nick Gonzales recommend coffee enemas for those who are extremely allergic and toxic.
Dr. Gonzales actually recommends the coffee enemas for everyone. He says that we are all subjected to way too many toxins in our modern day and age. From fluoride in the water, petrochemicals in our shampoo and body lotions, bromide in the carpeting and furniture in our homes, the air we breathe, etc. etc.
It’s so hard in this day and age — all the toxins we all encounter on a daily basis. This is true for EVERYONE — not just people who have obvious allergies (and in fact, a lot of people have hidden allergies).
I was just reading something Dave Wetzel of Green Pasture Products said (they make the fermented cod liver oil). He said that they put the cod liver oil on their toddler’s skin and he was able to absorb the nutrients just as well as ingesting it. (I’m going to email him and find out how he knows that it was just as effective; I’m working on a post about this.)
Anyhow, what was really interesting to me was how we can so easily absorb through our pores. I knew this intellectually before but I guess I never really got it. But think about it — if we can absorb nutrients via our skin so easily, what ELSE are we absorbing? I want to do a whole post on this, too.
07/02/2010 at 11:49 pm Permalink
Be careful with the coffee enemas. I’m not a super-sensitive person in general, but I am very sensitive to caffeine. I had a couple of coffee enemas many years ago when I was in Thailand on a fasting/colon hydrotherapy retreat (ah, those were the days), and I felt very, very sick when I got the coffee enemas (not so for the plain water enemas). It seems the caffeine can be absorbed from the bowel. So if you’re sensitive to caffeine, just be forewarned.
Jeanmarie´s last blog ..Coconut Ghee, the Perfect Cooking Fat
07/02/2010 at 11:53 pm Permalink
That’s so true about detoxifying!!!! Dr. Christopher’s philosophy was cleanse – nourish – heal. He believed that any illness could be cured this way. I’ve spent hours on his education site http://www.herballegacy.com. I don’t agree that everyone should permanently go on the “mucusless diet” that he recommends (although I guess it could be fine temporarily) because of course I’m a W.A.P. fan, but the information about healing herbs is fascinating. My kids LOVE the kid’s drops and they’re all herbs without sugar and fillers. The “Lower Bowel” formula has really helped me start cleansing. I haven’t had the courage to try an enema yet
. Imagine how much gunk gets reabsorbed into our systems just because it sits there when we’re constipated (as a large percentage of our population is)! Dr. Gerson (a WAP contemporary who cured many cases of cancer) also recommended coffee enemas. I’m about to start Dr. Christopher’s extended cleanse, which includes the lower bowel, liver and gall bladder, kidneys, and even blood stream. Cleansing is SO necessary!
About the skin… my youngest brother (youngest of 8, my mom was 46 when he was born) has a chromosomal deletion (called 18P Syndrome). When he was a baby we knew there was something that wasn’t quite right, but we didn’t know what it was until he was a year an a half and had genetic testing done. Anyway… he didn’t really grow for the first 6 months. About that time our family’s naturopath did tests and found he had a high level of some sort of toxin, and he was missing a number of amino acids. (Meanwhile the medical doctor kept saying he was find and was just small.) The naturopath told my mom to give him mega-doses of vitamin E, an antioxidant, to help him flush out the toxin. My mom used to slather it on his skin. Very shortly thereafter he started gaining weight and went from looking like a starving, scrawny baby with a distended abdomen, to a chubby baby! I just read the blurb about the toddler and CLO too and I have no doubt it works! That’s why I avoid lotions, etc. and just slather myself with cocoa butter and coconut oil. We just have to do our best with the resources we have, don’t we?
08/02/2010 at 12:25 am Permalink
@ Jeanmarie
Yes you are supposed to use weak coffee, not strong coffee, from what I’ve read.
08/02/2010 at 12:26 am Permalink
Geez, I hope you people are not suggesting that those of us with IgE mediated severe allergies can cure them with coffee enemas and other so-called remedies. Food allergies are immune system and autoimmune disorders, and the only treatment is avoidance of the allergenic substances. I would hope you wouldn’t have the audacity to recommend these remedies to a child with peanut, egg, milk or fish allergies. Well, news flash… Corn and other food allergies are every bit as dangerous for some of us, as the above allergens. If you don’t understand the difference between IgE food allergies, and toxins and toxic chemicals, then please refrain from giving advice. It is not helpful, and may be downright harmful and confusing to someone who is newly diagnosed with food allergies.
08/02/2010 at 12:38 am Permalink
@ Kaylin
Wow that is so interesting!
From what I have read, it’s the antioxidants in juices that help flush out the toxins.
And coffee enemas work supposedly because the coffee stimulates the liver. So if you do both, that’s really powerful.
Acc. to Campbell-McBride and others, it’s gut damage that makes it hard for us not only to absorb nutrients, but also to detoxify toxins. This is why kids on the autistic spectrum have so much trouble absorbing nutrients AND detoxifying heavy metals and other toxins. Which is why they have a hard time with vaccines — they cannot detoxify them properly.
If the gut is already damaged, and the liver is also struggling, yeah you can see that it would just keep getting worse and worse over time. From what I have read, one allergy leads to more and more allergies over time (this is what Dr. William Crook said in his book, “The Yeast Connection” — this is the book that helped me heal myself of chronic yeast overgrowth, gluten intolerance, etc. in my 20s). Because the more we keep eating the allergen our gut cannot digest, the more it damages our gut, and we become less able to detoxify, and then we become more and more allergic. A very vicious cycle indeed.
08/02/2010 at 12:55 am Permalink
@ Donnie
“Geez, I hope you people are not suggesting that those of us with IgE mediated severe allergies can cure them with coffee enemas and other so-called remedies.”
I’m not a doctor, and no, I’m not recommending anything to anyone. I was referring to the work of Dr. Campbell-McBride and Dr. Gonzales.
“Food allergies are immune system and autoimmune disorders, and the only treatment is avoidance of the allergenic substances.”
For many people, there are other treatments to food allergies beyond avoidance. I’m not referring to your specific allergy — I have no idea what your situation is.
Dr. Campbell-Mcbride is an MD, a pediatrician and neurologist in Cambridge, England. She is actually reversing allergies as well as autism and other spectrum disorders in her practice. This is called the GAPS diet. She recommends a very restricted yet very nutrient-dense diet (restricts all allergens — all foods that require enzymes to digest — disaccharides and polysaccharides — the only allowed foods are monosaccharides), plus therapeutic-grade probiotics, cod liver oil, in addition to as juicing, coffee enemas and epsom salt baths.
Dr. Gonzales is an MD in New York City. He is reversing cancer. Including pancreatic cancer with his protocol of diet, supplements, juicing, and yes, coffee enemas.
08/02/2010 at 1:20 am Permalink
@ Kaylin
Oh and I forgot to say — coffee enemas are really easy to do. I haven’t done coffee enemas, just regular enemas. But it’s so easy. With the coffee enemas (I believe it’s described in the book “Gut & Psychology Syndrome”) you just make some weak coffee and use that instead of water. Of course it needs to be organic coffee and filtered or better yet RO or distilled water. I think I shall start doing them from time to time (although maybe not daily).
Dr. Gonzales said that he thought he was healthy until he started doing coffee enemas. He never knew what real health was, he said, until he did coffee enemas. I guess it does sound strange maybe but coffee enemas were widely accepted until recent years. They were even in the Merck Manual until 1972.
08/02/2010 at 1:32 am Permalink
@ Donnie
No need to get defensive.
“Food allergies are immune system and autoimmune disorders, and the only treatment is avoidance of the allergenic substances.”
The body is a self-healing organism. There are many people who have been able to treat these conditions by cleansing, nourishing, and other methods. I have a brother who USED TO be very allergic to peanuts.
I am not a doctor and I am not suggesting that anyone take their allergies lightly or behave irresponsibly, nor did I make any such suggestion in my earlier comment. However, I also don’t believe that just because mainstream medicine says that a condition is “incurable” that we have to take their opinion as absolute truth. There is a reason they call it a medical “practice”.
08/02/2010 at 1:35 am Permalink
@ Ann Marie
Thanks for the encouragement. I just might try it! I’ll have to dig out my coffee maker from storage. All I ever make is espresso–don’t think I’ll try using that!!!!
08/02/2010 at 1:48 am Permalink
@ Kaylin
Yeah I don’t think I’d try espresso either LOL!
And yeah! I’ve cured myself of lots of things that most people say are “incurable”. Melasma, rheumatoid arthritis, CFS, chemical sensitivities, gluten intolerance. I even naturally regrew a chip in my front tooth! That one really blew me away. But if our nails and hair grow, why wouldn’t we also expect the same of our teeth and bones?
The body is an amazing thing. You do have to give it the right fuel, however.
08/02/2010 at 6:29 am Permalink
I don’t know enough about all this to have an opinion, really, but it seems to me, isn’t WAP usually about eating traditional foods that our ancestors would have eaten? And, I don’t know, how long have people been eating meat, and how long have they been doing whatever they do to get it ready to be eaten, but probably they used water for quite a while before anyone thought to come up with a lactic acid spray, right?
So I thought it was kind of strange that John called it a “crazy method.”
Also, he said “the scalding water will blanch and discolor the meat which is not consumer friendly,” but wouldn’t it just blanch and discolor the outer layer? And isn’t the big reason that it’s supposed to be fine to use the spray because the outer layer is removed? So. If the outer layer is going to be removed either way…what difference does it make if it’s blanched or discolored? Isn’t that fine if the other option is for it to be gray and gross? I probably just don’t understand, and maybe the damaged outer layer is thicker with the water, or something. But then, I just don’t really get why it would be pasteurized, either, except for the very outer (discarded) layer. The inside of the carcass wouldn’t get anyway near that hot.
As far as it taking a lot of energy to heat water up to 200 degrees, is it really that much more than the energy required to grow fields of corn, harvest them, transport that stuff, do whatever they do to process it, do whatever they do to ferment it, do whatever they do to purify it and sort of test it, and make it into their special spray, and then transport that spray to places all over the country? Each of those steps would have specialists and employees and offices and paperwork and gas and cars, and pollution etc. Which is an awful lot of energy, right?
I’ve been reading many of your posts for the past several months, and I love your blog! I often read whole posts from your blog aloud to my fiance; I joke with him that he secretly writes your blog, because sooo many times, he will have been talking about something (kefir! kombucha! raw milk! sprouting!) and then within a couple days you blog about whatever it was that he started discussing with me. Kinda fun.
Sorry if I’m asking you stupid questions–I’m slowly learning a lot about real food, and I know that this is good stuff, and I’ve already really changed a whole lot about the way that I eat, but this stuff just didn’t quite make sense to me. My comment is not a criticism of your post or of US Wellness meats, or of anyone else, and of course I don’t expect you to spend lots of time doing special research about harvesting cows, or the history of cows, or any of that because I read your comments about how busy you are and how little money you make doing this. I thought maybe it would be something that you could explain in a little response and then it would click for me.
Thanks.
Emily´s last blog ..iPad
08/02/2010 at 12:01 pm Permalink
My head is spinning from all this. I was staying out of it specifically because everything had already been said (and then some), but since there have been some inflammatory comments at KC’s post (from “Anonymous”, no surprise) and now KC thinks “it’s interesting that a comment from Kelly the Kitchen Kop was conspicuously absent”, fine. I’ll share my thoughts.
I don’t fault KC for mentioning this in her blog, since she writes about corn-free issues and she’s very allergic to corn herself. But because grass-based sustainable farmers are stuck between a rock and a hard place (regarding this lactic acid spray), this doesn’t change the fact that there is still NO comparison between their meat and factory-farmed meat. That doesn’t help KC or others who are highly allergic to corn, but for those of us who realize we can’t always get rid of every single drop of anything “bad” in our world, we’re just thankful for everything these farmers do. All this discussion and even the disagreements are fine and it’s all good (that’s why blogs are great, to get the information out there), until some cross the line and get nasty. In the end, it’s just those type of comments that make small farmers who are bending over backward to offer high-quality meat feel beaten down. And it makes us bloggers feel the same, especially when we’re attacked for “only defending our sponsors” and “just being in this for the money”. Ha, what a joke! If I was in this for the money, I wouldn’t be in this. (And I would’ve left up my Google ads.)
Kelly
Kelly the Kitchen Kop´s last blog ..What the Weston Price Foundation Means to Me (Real Food Wednesday)
08/02/2010 at 12:16 pm Permalink
Spraying with 200 degree water doesn’t sound very traditional to me. How would indigenous people groups have been able to get such a large quantity of water heated to 200 degrees to spray their meat? I doubt they would have sprayed it at all considering their animals probably weren’t caked with manure in the first place since they spent their lives grazing in open pasture. I think I’ve read that some cultures buried the carcass in the ground to age the meat because the temperature and conditions were perfect. We all know what the FDA would think of that. And, since the indigenous people didn’t have allergies, they didn’t have to worry about microscopic traces of “allergens” on their food.
08/02/2010 at 1:30 pm Permalink
The way this situation has turned out is all very disappointing. I truly believe Ann Marie has made a valid point – that a person who had an allergic reaction to something (which in and of itself is not a small thing) was able to infer, without a doubt in her mind, that she reacted to USWM products. And her assertion was a damaging one toward this company without actual proof.
Yes, it’s unfortunate, and I’m sorry kc and her family have had this problem. Of course corn is a problem for someone with corn allergies, I’m not leaving that out. But the GMO stuff is really another issue – yes, it is an issue, notice here I am not making light of it, just saying that it’s separate.
Maybe the next step is for USWM to at least consider some other substance, such as hot water as one person said or other grains (Sally Fallon’s suggestion), with which to treat the meat. I realize that doing this step would be difficult and maybe next to impossible, but apparently some farmers are able to do it, so who knows?
With that said, however, I’m really appalled at the level to which people will stoop to criticize another: saying that because USWM is a sponsor, all Ann Marie cares about is money. It’s certain that none of the people pointing the finger know that Ann Marie clearly cares about more than money as is evident by all the time and effort she puts forth keeping up this site and Real Food Media. It’s hours upon hours of hard, exhausting work which pays little. All anyone has to do is take a look at all the people who are receiving help as a result of this site and others like it, the realization could be made that it’s basically free information to those who have an Internet connection. It just goes to prove that when people become emotional and/or irrational, they resort to the most childish behavior.
Raine Saunders´s last blog ..Gallbladder Disease and The Standard American Diet – My Personal Account
08/02/2010 at 2:06 pm Permalink
Well said, Raine. I’ve been thinking some of the same things.
08/02/2010 at 3:49 pm Permalink
I highly support Kelly the Kitchen Kop’s comment. Highly allergenic people can react to even trace amounts of the substance to which they are allergic and things leach into other things. I have a celiac friend react to things that have no gluten in them (but we wonder if they came in contact with gluten). I have a friend who is allergic to tomatoes and always asks if the lettuce is even in contact with tomatoes before ordering. Even such trace amounts that we don’t detect, her body does.
On the other hand, like Kelly I see it as very frustrating for US Wellness Meats. I think they are small producer trying their best to do the best they can for their customers and still make their products affordable and comply with US requirements.
KC, no matter how you take the comments, you have started a GREAT discussion and one that needs to be heard by more than just us Foodies. John is only one person and even if he gets together with all the other small retailers, they don’t have as much power as the larger companies around them. John’s choices reflect the best he can do right now–maybe that will change.
I appreciate both sides of the argument. I am fortunate both that I don’t think I am that allergic to corn and that I can by “off the hoof” from a farmer and butcher who can take care in what I eat. However, I work with people with allergies all the time and I feel for people who are allergic to those things like corn and soy which have become so ubiquitous.
To speak to allergies again, many people have healed their bodies through diet and cleansing. However, others don’t. Some people do very well with NAET or acupuncture. This doesn’t mean that they can safely eat anything. I also notice that when someone does a real cleansing diet like GAPS, if their body isn’t ready for something it reacts even more strongly to it than it normally would. Everyone is different because every body is different.
Bonnie´s last blog ..Looking Good or Being Healthy
08/02/2010 at 9:14 pm Permalink
Dear “DONNIE”- could you please email me mercedesludlow at gmail dot com. I have a severe sulfite allergy I have struggled with most of my life- it has gotten pretty severe lately, plummeting BP, asthma symptoms- it’s quite scary. I cannot find very much info about it besides that if it is greater than 10-ppm it must be labeled. But of course you know, I react to things all the time. I would really appreciate some things you have found out about this. Thanks.
08/02/2010 at 10:10 pm Permalink
Didn’t KC say that her 2 children also had this meat and and a reaction so that’s 3 people right there, not just her.
Why not just spray with the hot water even if it becomes discolored, if the outside layer is being cut off anyway.
Another thing, wouldn’t the knife become “contaminated” from the first cut touching the lactic acid spray then “infect” the other trims?
09/02/2010 at 12:04 am Permalink
>Another thing, wouldn’t the knife become “contaminated” from the first cut touching the lactic acid spray then “infect” the other trims?
Any corn, or other allergen, on the surface of the meat will contaminate more of it, when it is cut off. Those of us with corn allergy run into that with many foods that have corn on the surface. Such as corn based wax on fruits and vegetables. We wash and scrub it off as best we can, if possible. Cutting into foods or peeling them will just carry the corn substance to the rest of the food.
And in the case of lactic or citric acids on meats, and meat packaging, it is intended to penetrate into the flesh of the meat, to kill pathogens. Mechanically tenderized meat can have the lactic acid all the way through it. Cutting off the surface of the meat will help remove some of the lactic acid, but there will still be contamination of the flesh below. Washing does not remove very much of the lactic acid, either. Once it’s there, it will always be there, in some amount. And enough to cause reactions in a person with corn allergies.
Ground beef is a major offender, but other cuts can be a problem, too. Especially, when the packaging contains corn, which most do. Supermarket beef is certainly the worst for corn contamination, among other nasties. And, definitely needs to be avoided.
I found a local natural butcher shop that sells meat that is OK, it’s the packaging that is loaded with corn-crap. Most likely lactic/citric acids. Possibly PLA (Polylactic acid plastic) wrap or foam tray which is made from corn. There is no soaker pad, that is loaded with corn lactic or citric acid, like other stores use. I take my own GLAD heavy-duty plastic freezer bags, and my meat is placed in them. No store packaging for my meat purchases, they are selected from the display case, and go directly into my own Glad bags. That works out OK for me.
I had reactions to the meats when they were put in the corn-crap packaging materials. I am very happy I was able to figure out what to do to get meat that is safe for me to eat.
09/02/2010 at 2:36 am Permalink
Hi. I am divided on this one…I am a HUGE fan of this site as this blogger turned me onto the GAPs diet and my son is recovering from severe autism because of that intervention and HBOT. I think the blogger with the severe corn allergy and the very French stance on GMOs in her expensive “real” meats shouldn;t be blasted, folks. My pals in France would applaud her, seriously. I am a fan of Wellness, but I don’t have the same issues as the blogger, thank God, and if I did I would definitely thank HER for doing her homework and putting out the word. If WALMART can sell a better milk product now bc of consumer awareness and demand, why can’t integrity producers come under market pressure to do the same for US…I am with Sally, the French, and the blogger on this one. No GMOs where not necessary….and though your blog was extremely informative and I LOVE your site…you didn;t make a case for the necessity of their processing choice over better, safer, cleaner ones. If we all wanted it, they would do it….but if nobody not even CHEESESLAVE cares all that much, why bother? AM…say no to cheaper choices and GMOs where they don’t need to be for our sakes, please, as you have the producers’ ears. I will continue to order from US Wellness, but I am going to look for alternatives now…and why not? Companies who go that extra step when it is cheaper, easier, and ACCEPTABLE even to do otherwise, even by foodies like AM….THEY need our support. Just THINK about asking Wellness to consider making this adjustment. They seem like a nice company, but what they are doing is wrong on so many levels….they should not be supporting GMO products, period. I wish I was back in France. Matt would never have gotten autism and I wouldn;t have to wonder, worry, or even have this sort of debate/dilemma about my “healthy” foods. Diane
09/02/2010 at 2:42 am Permalink
Hey – I want to clarify…I don;t for a second think that AM doesn;t care about GMOs…I meant that the degree of presence in this manufacturer’s products is no issue for her, and that someone like her carries a lot more clout than just another customer like myself. I didn;t like the whistleblower’s nasty dig about AM kissing up to a sponsor and I think it was unfair. This is a fabulous and informative blog….and I rarely ever post bc I am almost always in complete agreement with you AM, and ever grateful for the hard work you put in…Diane
09/02/2010 at 4:28 am Permalink
” I wish I was back in France. Matt would never have gotten autism.” This is an extraordinary statement. It’s true France has a lower autism rate, but they still have autism. There are doubtless multiple contributing factors, including age of the parents, so you can’t know that if you’d lived in France your child wouldn’t have gotten autism.
Honestly, I wonder whether half the people commenting here have even read what Ann Marie and kc have written. No one has expressed any lack of concern about GMO contamination, no one has said it’s ok, no one has said kc’s concerns aren’t important. No one has said the presence of GMOs was not an issue of concern.
Jeanmarie´s last blog ..Coconut Ghee, the Perfect Cooking Fat
09/02/2010 at 9:15 pm Permalink
Wow… I am stunned by your bias and I have been a vocal supporter of small farmers for decades. In fact, I work on farms and I’m moving into purchasing our own shortly. You have attacked KC and her blog and that is simply in low taste.
I am doing work on food sovereignty and protecting the lands and livelihoods of our small farmers. I spent last summer butchering meat in a small, local abattoir. I’m happy to report that there are still custom butchers that are skinning, gutting, and butchering animals without any sort of spray being added. The meat is hung for approximately three weeks after which the dried, outside flesh is trimmed off.
You are not responsible for the judgement of other’s blog posts. KC reported on a spray that US Wellness Meats uses on their product. No, they aren’t the only one, but many people do purchase their product because they are educated about the problems with feedlot beef and all of the inherent problems found within. That there is a spray containing GMO being applied to that meat is a concern, or isn’t, depending on the individual. However, we all have the right to know and to make that decision. It is not for you to deem it inconsequential.
I find your stance to be arrogant and out of line. How much money you once made is irrelevant to your argument and does nothing to augment your virtuous position.
10/02/2010 at 1:12 am Permalink
you asked
”
When I spoke to Kerston, I believe he said that there are only 2 processing plants in all of northern California that will take smaller farmers on (and harvest fewer steers). They don’t have a lot of choice.
Did your butcher, the one you called, actually process the meat from the beginning to end? If not, she may not even know what happens. We’re not talking about the butcher who cuts up the meat. We’re talking about the “harvester” who initially harvests the animal and removes the hide.”
Maybe I should have called them a harvester/butcher. They kill/skin/slice up/package the animal all at the same place. So they know what happens. They will even go to your farm and kill the animal on site and take it back to the coolers and then package it up to specifications.
I agree that these kind of guys are really hard to find.
10/02/2010 at 1:48 am Permalink
Author: MML
Comment:
Dear “DONNIE”- could you please email me….
MML,
Did you get the private e-mail I sent you, with sulfite allergy info? If not, contact me again, and I will leave some info here in comments.
Donnie
corn/sulfite allergies
10/02/2010 at 1:57 pm Permalink
Donnie, Got it. Many thanks. Checking it out right now.
10/02/2010 at 3:24 pm Permalink
I read that blogger’s post! Sounded like an extreme example and I’m happy to read your followup on it. As for US Wellness Meats – you can’t please everyone all the time. But they seem to be doing a great job of pleasing most people most of the time.
Michelle @ Find Your Balance´s last blog ..Heat it, mix it, top it, eat it
10/02/2010 at 4:37 pm Permalink
I agree with Tara. My husband worked for several years at a mom and pop butcher shop in Michigan, that did the whole process. THe only “spray” they use, is cold well water.
As for us, we do the entire process as well.
Starting in the woods, ;o)
Paula
Paula Runyan´s last blog ..Energy Efficient slow cooking
10/02/2010 at 11:45 pm Permalink
@ Paula
Yes I”m sure there are very small producers that do it differently. I guess we have to consider what is realistic and cost effective for farms we can actually buy from. Not everyone can butcher their own animals, or buy from a neighbor or a super-small farm. Especially those of use who live in big cities and suburbs.
On a different subject:
Paula, do you have access to bear fat? I was just listening to Sally Fallon talking about how high bear fat is in vitamin K2. Just curious…
10/02/2010 at 11:52 pm Permalink
@ Tara
The only reason I brought up what I used to earn and what I earn now is to prove the point that I am not motivated by money. And the only reason I brought this up is because KC started spreading the rumor that I was only supporting USWM because they are one of Real Food Media’s sponsors. I could see that she might have a point if maybe I was earning a living wage from our sponsors, but I’m not. This is a brand new business and I am not even breaking even.
I am sorry that you find my stance “arrogant”. It’s odd that you do, since the literal definition of arrogance is having an excess of pride. I didn’t see my post as prideful — however, it is factual and logical.
Not to sound like a broken record, but a logical argument is one in which you can support your position with facts or evidence. I do not think KC supported her position that the ground beef made her react. She may THINK it did, but she did not present any real proof.
If KC had simply written, “I think I may have reacted to the ground beef and I want to warn others who have corn allergies,” this would be an entirely different situation. I would have had no problem with that.
However, she didn’t say that. She said she was certain that she reacted to the ground beef. That’s what I have a problem with. She’s making claims not backed up with facts.
If you think it’s “arrogant” of me to point that out, that is your perception. But journalism is based on facts, not made up stories. We may not be professional journalists or reporters, but we still need to try to be objective and factual.
11/02/2010 at 12:52 am Permalink
cheeseslave
let me summarize your body of work
“wahhh leave my friends alone. the chemical manufacturer told me it’s ok”
you are making claims without backing it up with facts.
you actually believe you produced evidence by parroting what PURAC told you on the phone? secondhand statements from a gmo source chemical manufacturer?
QUOTE
They didn’t make it up out of thin air. It’s documented fact. Now, I didn’t *see* a document stating that the lactic acid solution was 98% water.
Honestly, I didn’t have tons of time to get this post up and I had already spent enough time. But yeah, I am sure I could go and pull up that document somewhere and produce it.
END QUOTE
you admit it, but still somehow keep saying you produced facts and kc did not (neither of you have). all you’ve produced is clear evidence that you are blindly biased, a hypocrite and not a journalist.
11/02/2010 at 1:27 am Permalink
Purac is going to be used in a lot more foods, besides fresh meats. This is going to be a nightmare for people allergic to corn or sulfites. It is not likely to be labeled, any more then it is with meat that is processed with Purac. Here is an article about the increased use of that Purac corn crap.
http://www.foodingredientsfirst.com/news/Purac-Launches-Natural-Food-safety-Solution-for-Refrigerated-Food.html
Or use this link to the same webpage, if the above url wraps.
http://tinyurl.com/ykg5qba
Donnie
11/02/2010 at 1:46 am Permalink
donnie haven’t you been reading? purac empirically proved their product safe by telling someone it’s OK on the phone. gmo friendly chemical manufacturers are health experts that care deeply about our health. yay i hope my suppliers start using extra!
11/02/2010 at 4:51 pm Permalink
Your response is just silly. Please stop quoting literal definitions of words back to people. I’m quite sure that people know what the words they are using mean.
Arrogant, “the literal definition” is beyond being prideful, it is, and I quote from the Merriam-Webster dictionary: ” exaggerating or disposed to exaggerate one’s own worth or importance often by an overbearing manner “. That is a exactly what I meant by arrogant.
I agree with the commenters above who find your lack of evidence, or shall I say your deemed inconsequential evidence, hypocritical given the subject of your post.
Donnie, thank you for posting that information. I will be sure to follow up on this and educate my clients to question their farmers and butchers on the use of this horrible product.
11/02/2010 at 5:51 pm Permalink
Hi guys,
I’ve been very patient dealing with all these comments but quite frankly the name-calling and accusations (“arrogant,” “hypocrite,” biased due to money, etc.) are not getting us anywhere.
People who resort to name calling or ad hominem attacks typically do so because they don’t have much of an argument (in other words, can’t back up their argument with facts), or perhaps they just don’t know how to debate.
If you want to have an intelligent debate about this issue, I’m more than happy to do it. In fact, that’s what I’ve been trying to do all along.
But name calling doesn’t further the discussion. I won’t respond to those comments anymore.
Please read this excellent article on how to disagree (the excerpt above is from that article):
http://www.paulgraham.com/disagree.html
The author of that article points out that blaming someone for their “tone” (i.e. arrogance) is not a valid argument.
Though better than attacking the author, this is still a weak form of disagreement. It matters much more whether the author is wrong or right than what his tone is. Especially since tone is so hard to judge. Someone who has a chip on their shoulder about some topic might be offended by a tone that to other readers seemed neutral.
So if the worst thing you can say about something is to criticize its tone, you’re not saying much. Is the author flippant, but correct? Better that than grave and wrong. And if the author is incorrect somewhere, say where.
I repeat: if you want to discuss this in an intelligent, calm, and most importantly, logical manner, please proceed and I will respond.
Thanks!
11/02/2010 at 6:30 pm Permalink
Ann Marie, you’re far more patient than I ever could have been. I wonder why the snide commenters even bothered to show up here if they have so much disdain for you. For my part, I find you to be eminently professional, well-informed, patient, fair-minded, and generous with your time. You act like some kind of *adult* or something!
I thank you, kc, and everyone who brought the ubiquity-of-GMOs issue to our collective attention. I also appreciate the farmers, ranchers, butchers, and small companies that are working hard to make a difference, and the innovators and agitators who are trying to make things even better. I commiserate with those who face a daily struggle to find pure foods their sensitive bodies won’t react to.
Some people don’t understand that we can agree to disagree, or that one can respect someone’s right to their opinion without agreeing with that opinion. Conversely, to disagree with someone’s opinion is not necessarily to disparage them. It’s possible, I’m told, to disagree without being disagreeable.
We can all learn something from each other if we’re open to it, but if one gets so *angry* just because someone disagrees that they must resort to cutting sarcasm and opining about someone else’s motives, maybe it has nothing to do with the other person at all. Just a thought.
Jeanmarie´s last blog ..Coconut Ghee, the Perfect Cooking Fat
11/02/2010 at 7:21 pm Permalink
I have been following this line for awhile. I am curious why folks are finding it necessary to call names. Honestly, if someone wants to defend something, it is their right. AM did her best to provide evidence behind what she was saying. Unless someone has evidence based arguments to throw back, or at the very least real experience with the matter, the rude and offensive comments aren’t helping in any way, and in the end may end future chances at *real* debate. You can intelligently disagree with someone-it is part of being human. Being belligerent is not aiding the discussion one iota. Attacking someone on the grounds that they are doing something for monetary purposes, without real data supporting that decision is libelous and I would have to discourage. I would hope that the sort of person who takes the time to read a blog like this one, and the others in the ring, would be enlightened enough to make full, coherent, and respectful, whether in agreement or not, thoughts and statements. I am more discouraged by what had followed in comments on this article than the article itself, though I have my own thoughts on the matter, and wholeheartedly support some previous statements the thinking commentators have made. Keep your trash talk in the bathroom, people.
11/02/2010 at 7:22 pm Permalink
Wow. I have been following posts here for a few days, but previously convinced myself not to respond. The more I read the more frustrated I become…with BOTH SIDES of this argument!
First, let me say I’m a big fan of this blog. My family follows the WAPF way of eating and I just love that there are blogs whose authors take the time and effort to educate and share their experiences. I personally find great value in this, and I’m grateful.
When I read the original blog I empathized with the writer, while at the same time feeling that perhaps the post should have been written a little differently. I applaud her for sharing her experience, AND for sharing her concern over the GM corn derived spray. I see absolutely nothing wrong with this. For those of us who have food allergies, often our own experience and “best guess” as to where our symptoms originated are all we have. So perhaps the blogger should have stated that, to the best of her knowledge, and after careful and thorough investigation of her ingredients sources, she believe her meat *MAY BE* contaminated with a corn derivative that has caused her reaction. Certainly sharing her frustration with the fact that the spray is from genetically modified food is valid! I personally make every effort reasonable to avoid GM’s, but probably wouldn’t spend much time on this particular product. If I had my choice, I would buy products TOTALLY GM free, and I’d be happy to let Wellness Meats know my opinion, but it wouldn’t likely change my purchase habits in this case. That’s just me.
Do I prefer my meat to be sprayed with lactic acid rather than ammonia? Of course!
Would I further prefer it to be sprayed with something totally benign, such as water? ABSOLUTELY. But we all pick our battles.
This particular blogger is someone who shares her experiences with those of us looking for a natural way of eating, but ALSO particularly (and maybe even more importantly) with those who suffer a specific corn allergy. I can see why she feels a sense of obligation to share her experience. I agree that she, perhaps, needs to be careful with how definitively she posts her conclusions (unless she has access to some type of laboratory who can absolutely confirm her suspicions).
I see the value in KC’s letting us know US Wellness is using a GM product. Knowledge is power. I also am grateful to Cheeseslave for researching this subject. Now I have more information and can make a decision for my family as to whether we’re at risk in this situation. I will likely contact US Wellness and let them know I’m not a fan of the spray, but I will still purchase their product. I feel the risk is minimal for *MY* family since we don’t have any corn allergies, but I want them to know how I feel about the spray.
“If we don’t support our small farmers and stand behind them and support them, how can we expect to create a food revolution in this country and around the world?” -Cheeseslave
*I absolutely agree. This doesn’t mean we don’t share our knowledge with on another, or give the farmer our opinion. We just need to be careful about the way in which we do it.
“I have no problems with the lactic acid treatment — sounds quite natural.” -Sally Fallon
*HUGE Sally Fallon here, but…quite natural? I’m not sure you can derive anything natural from a source so un-natural as GM corn. I would have expected something more like “Perhaps not the best choice, but not likely to seriously impact most people. I wouldn’t be too concerned”.
“Where is your “evidence” that the lactic acid solution is 2%? that the gray part is cut off? That no gmo dna remains in the fermented end product?
Someone told you that stuff. someone told you they reacted. all hearsay, but you treat the info you like as substantiated fact while attacking kc’s credibility to report her OWN PERSONAL EXPERIENCE?” -riixx
*For the record, I actually agree with this. When I read Cheeseslaves long criticism of KC’s “logic”, all I could think was how Cheeseslaves conclusions were also derived from hearsay. That doesn’t mean her conclusions were wrong, or invalid, just not based on absolute FACT (much like KC’s conclusions). If Cheeseslave provided a lab report showing no GM corn DNA was in the final product, THAT would be fact. I believe she is holding KC to standards of fact that she herself is not meeting. And that…is illogical.
I just think this whole thing could have been dealt with differently. KC should have worded her concerns a little differently, Cheeseslave was a bit…uhmm….aggressive with her responses (and less than logical at times as well), and riixx? Your next post was childish at best.
I read the article on how to disagree. Sure, those things are valid. But not everyone’s quite so analytical, nor do they have dictionary.com on speed-dial. I am known for being TOO analytical, and I know people have found that part of me a little obnoxious. Now I know why.
15/02/2010 at 5:10 pm Permalink
There are many ways to clear food and other sensitivities. I have done it with EFT and other meridian techniques with clients. You can do this yourselves. One of the best sites is http://www.allergyantidotes.com Sandy Radomski specializes in clearing sensitivities from chemical to food. I have no affiliation with Sandy other then I have used some of her techniques successfully with clients. The tapping world summit is coming up – I also have no affiliation with this. This is a free event that lasts over a week. This year there will be sections on cravings and addiction as well as cancer support – much more as well but these are the ones that are relevant to this discussion. If you are interested in learning meridian tapping techniques and letting go of your food issues this is the place to start. http://www.tappingworldsummit.com
If you notice that you got irritated and frustrated with this blog discussion tapping will help with that too:o)
By the way, I have a small raw milk dairy in Southern Oregon and grow most of our foods as well as teaching Meridian Tapping Techniques. If you have questions about tapping techniques you are free to contact me at aliza@eftashland.com and I’ll do my best to connect you with the information you need.
Aliza
Some Kinda Wonderful Farm
03/03/2010 at 8:58 pm Permalink
Hi Anne-Marie,
I too want to thank you for your careful and helpful research. I know this was a lot of work and I really appreciate your doing it. The facts you so ably and thoroughly presented gave me the information I needed to decide the issue.
The namecalling, insults, and accusations on this thread makes me sad. I think that just about all of us in this community want to eat safe meat, support small farmers, avoid GMOs, and give our families the best possible food. We have so much in common. The goal of this should not be to win the argument, but to learn the truth.
Anne-Marie, you have been totally civil and respectful, even when personally attacked, and I thank you for that.
Stanley Fishman´s last blog ..Cooking Real Food — The Most Important Task