
Phil Hartman as Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer (Click the link to watch the video — hilarious!)
Update: I’m a big advocate of freedom of speech and believe in lively debate and sharing of opinions. That said, name-calling, fighting, and general nastiness will no longer be tolerated. I don’t have a comments policy posted anywhere on this blog, so I’m posting it now. Any comments that are disrespectful, rude, and/or contain foul language will be deleted as spam. If you get enough spam comments, your comments will no longer appear.
The paleo diet is the hottest fad diet since vegetarianism. If you’re not familiar with the movement, paleo folks eat a “paleolithic” or “caveman” diet of meat, more meat, and pretty much anything they can forage (berries, nuts and so forth). The only foods that are allowed are ones that were available prior to the dawn of agriculture 10,000 years ago.
If you’re following a paleo diet and it is working for you, more power to you. We can agree to disagree.
Here are my top 10 reasons why I’m not paleo.
Top 10 Reasons I’m Not Paleo
1. I Really Like Cheese
Which is why I named this blog CHEESESLAVE. But cheese is verboten on the paleo diet.
Yes, I know some paleo people eat cheese, but many of them think that eating a chunk of cheddar is equivalent to making a pact with the devil. You see, according to their logic, cheese is a “neolithic” food, and therefore not paleolithic. At best, it’s considered a compromise food for most paleo folks.
It’s true, cheese is neolithic. And yet it has been a staple food among humans for over 10,000 years.
If that’s not “old” enough for you, how old is old enough? Homo habilis? Homo erectus?
I ask you, do we really need to go back 1 million years ago to eat a healthy diet?
And if so, why? Why do we need to go that far back? Are the health benefits of homo erectus that much better than those of say, someone living 100 or 200 or even 500 years ago?
Do we really need to throw the baby out with the bathwater and throw out all dairy (and the foods of domesticated animals) and all grains? If so, why? Is there evidence for that?
Sorry, I’m going into Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer here….
But honestly, if you’ve been eating paleo for any length of time, don’t you miss grilled cheese sandwiches? Quesadillas? Pizza?
Speaking of pizza and grilled cheese sandwiches…
2. I Really Like Bread
Crusty sourdough with lots of butter. Hearty brown German sunflower bread. Croissants. (Yes, croissants. They may be made with white flour, which is very low on the nutrient-density scale. But did you know they are almost 40% butter?)
And is bread really that bad for you? How can it be, when humans around the world have been thriving on it as a staple in their diet for over 10,000 years (and possibly up to 50,000 years)?
Is the modern epidemic of “gluten intolerance” really caused by eating wheat? Or is it possible that something else is causing gluten intolerance?
There is a theory that antibiotic drugs cause an imbalance of gut flora and cause prevent the digestive tract from secreting enzymes that enable us to break down complex proteins such as gluten. Sounds a lot more plausible than the idea that wheat suddenly started causing gluten intolerance out of nowhere.
I’m sure I’ll get lots of comments about Wheat Belly and the theory of “modern” wheat. Of course, I think that is a load of hogwash. Humans have been cross-breeding crops since the dawn of agriculture. And antibiotics are a LOT more harmful than modern wheat ever will be.
I will write a more detailed post about the flaws in the modern wheat theory at a later date when I finish reading the book.
3. I Really Like Cookies. And Cake. And Pies.
Hey, I understand, you’re on the GAPS diet, you can’t eat grains. That’s cool. I totally respect that. I gave up gluten for 2 years when I was healing my gut in my 20s. (And yes, I did overcome gluten intolerance.)
But would I go without grains for life? No way. I don’t eat sweets every day, but I do enjoy them often. And of course, I do try to use unrefined sweeteners.
And what is wrong with pies exactly? Oh sure, there’s some white flour in the crust. But it’s also loaded with nutritious butter and lard. Can this really be so bad?
And do you really need to eat like Australopithecus Afarensis to feel like you’re eating a healthy diet? Have you seen a picture of Australopithecus Afarensis lately?
Here you go:
Why not just go back one hundred years? Or even two hundred? That still constitutes a traditional diet. Heck, we could evren go back to the middle ages.
And you know what they ate in the middle ages? They ate pies.
4. Paleo is Low Carb
By default. And low carb messed me up. See my post: Why I Ditched Low Carb.
Be sure to read the bit about Chris Masterjohn, Dr. Weston Price, the people living near the Arctic Circle and fertility. That was key for me, and really opened my eyes. If you have to eat thyroid gland in order to reproduce, your low carb diet may not be working so well.
Hey, if you’re living in a place where you don’t have any access to carbs (i.e. the North Pole), then, yeah, it makes sense to go kill a bunch of moose and hand out the thyroid glands to the young people who want to have babies. But if you have ready access to carbs, such as potatoes and bread and rice, why not eat them?
And by the way, the Weston A. Price Foundation diet is not low carb. Dr. Price never recommended a low carb diet. There were some cultures he studied who ate low carb, but many others who did not. I’ll be writing a post about that soon.
5. The Paleo Diet is Too Restrictive
We live in a world dominated by pizza, nachos and chocolate chip cookies. Are you really going to tell your kids they can’t have these things — ever — because (ahem) “they’re not paleo”?
Why not, instead, learn how to make healthy versions of nachos and chocolate chip cookies and pizza (recipe coming soon)?
If you raise your children to be logical and good critical thinkers (and I hope you do), I don’t think they’ll fall for your flawed logic that a paleo is superior just because it is paleo. (See #6 and #7 below.)
I understand that we want our children to eat a nutritious diet. And there is nothing wrong with promoting nutritious foods and working hard to get our children to eat them. Obviously I am a proponent of that — otherwise, I would have never started this blog, and kept it going for almost five years.
I always tell my daughter she can’t have candy or cookies before dinner because they are foods that won’t make her grow big and strong. However, she’s allowed dessert after dinner. I try to serve nutrient-dense desserts like crème brûlée or ice cream made with grass-fed cream and egg yolks, chock-full of fat-soluble activators, vitamins A, D and K2.
I’d never tell her she can’t eat a cookie because “it’s not paleo”. That’s just bad logic.
And around here, we follow the 80/20 rule. A cookie here and there won’t kill you if you are eating a nutritious diet most of the time.
6. Paleo is Not Scalable
There’s a reason the hunters and gathers died out. Nothing against hunter-gatherers, but they were all almost completely wiped out by people who ate cheese and bread.
Why? How? Want the evidence? Read Jared Diamond’s fascinating book, Guns, Germs and Steel.
In the book, Diamond explains that there are advantages to learning how to domesticate animals — especially big herbivores such as goats, cows, horses and sheep. You can use them to plow fields faster. And they can provide you with high-protein, nutrient-dense foods such as milk, butter and cheese.
And there are benefits to growing grains, which will store for very long periods of time. If you’ve got a silo of grain, and a cow that gives you milk every day, you no longer have to spend your days hunting and foraging and scheming how you’re going to get your next meal, you have more time to do things like invent new kinds of technology. Like steel weapons, guns — and iPads.
Diamond tells an amazing story in Guns, Germs and Steel about the Spanish conquest of the Peruvian Inca. On November 15th 1532, 168 Spanish conquistadors showed up in the holy city of Cajamarca, Peru, where they found 80,000 Peruvian soldiers. Although seriously outnumbered, 168 Spaniards slaughtered over 7,000 Inca warriors within 24 hours.
![2[LA]B](http://www.cheeseslave.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/2LAB-1024x695.jpg)
How did this happen? (1) The Spaniards had horses and the Peruvians had no domesticated animals other than llamas, which could not be ridden. Soldiers on horseback had a distinct advantage over soldiers on foot. (2) The Spaniards had steel swords and guns. The Inca were unarmed.
While guns and steel killed many native people (as the above story illustrates), it was germs that were responsible for the genocide of the Indians:
European farmers, rearing cattle, pigs, sheep, goats, horses and donkeys, lived in close proximity with their animals — breathing, eating and drinking animal germs.
Native Americans had no domesticated animals, and when they were exposed to these germs from livestock, they perished in great numbers.
Is this to say that killing innocent people and taking their land is a good thing? No, Diamond is not defending colonialism; nor am I. He is simply making the point that there are very few hunter-gatherer tribes left on the planet because the world has changed and technology has advanced.
When we stop having to worry so much about how to find food, we are able to advance as a species.
Because hunting is so unpredictable, traditional societies have usually relied more on gathering. In this part of Papua New Guinea, the gathering is done by women. An important source of food here [in Papua New Guinea] is wild sago. By stripping a sago tree they can get to the pulp at the centre, which can be turned into dough and then cooked. Although it’s physically harder work, gathering is generally a more productive way of finding food than hunting. But it still doesn’t provide enough calories to support a large population.
Jared Diamond: This jungle around us, you might think it’s a cornucopia, but it isn’t. Most of these trees in the jungle don’t yield, don’t give us anything edible. There were just a few sago trees, and the rest of these trees don’t yield anything that we could eat.
And then sago itself has got limitations — one tree yields only maybe about 70 pounds of sago. It takes them three or four days to process that tree, so it’s a lot of work really for not a great deal of food, plus the sago starch is low on protein, and also the sago can’t be stored for a long time. And that’s why hunter/gatherer populations are so sparse. If you want to feed a lot of people, you’ve got to find a different food supply, you’ve got to find a really productive environment, and it’s not going to be a sago swamp. (Source)
7. Paleo is Based on Fantasy
The paleo diet is fundamentally flawed. It’s a diet based on misinformation about the past and the present. Paleo adherents believe that the hunter-gatherer lifestyle is somehow superior to that of the sedentary agriculturalist. It is a romantic ideal based on fantasy, not reality.
The reality is that living as a hunter-gatherer is not an easy life, and it was not a lifestyle people chose because they thought it was cool or better. Hunter-gatherers did/do not have access to domesticated animals and did not have the ability to grow crops. I find it very hard to believe that if they had cows or sheep that they would not have found a way to start milking them.
Why go forage for a meal or hunt for a wild animal when you can keep a cow who will give you milk every day with a lot less effort?
I guarantee you, if you were living in the wild, subsisting on sago that takes 3-4 days to process and is very low in protein, and someone brought you a cow that would give you milk every day, or showed you how to cultivate honey from a bee hive, you would jump at the chance.
According to Jared Diamond in Guns, Germs and Steel, cannibalism may have arisen in New Guinea due to the scarcity of sources of protein. The traditional crops, taro and sweet potato, are low in protein compared to wheat and pulses, and the only edible animals available were small or unappetizing, such as mice, spiders, and frogs. Cannibalism led to the spread of Kuru disease, affecting the brain, similar to Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease, prompting the Australian administration to outlaw the practice in 1959. (Source)
I’m not saying that if you become a hunter-gather, you will be driven to cannibalism. I’m just saying hunting and gathering isn’t all it’s cracked up to be. And maybe grains and legumes aren’t so bad after all. Balance is a good thing.
8. Paleo is Impractical
Is anyone really expecting people to get out and hunt for their breakfast? How about foraging? Are we expected to forage for our all of our meals? On top of working 9 hours per day plus taking care of the kids and getting them to soccer practice?
So how do we “do” paleo in the real world? Buy grass-fed beef and organic arugula from the upscale health food store? And is this really practical?
OK, I can see storing loads of meat and fish in the deep freeze. I do that.
But how do we stay on top of all the fresh veggies? We can’t serve beans or grains — so we must keep vast amounts of fresh veggies in the fridge and freezer.
If you ask me, it’s exhausting. Especially if you have a large family.
Now, I’m not knocking the GAPS Diet for those who really need it. If I had an autistic child and s/he was doing better on GAPS (and I’ve heard so many stories from moms whose kids have VASTLY improved on GAPS), you’d better believe I’d follow GAPS.
But GAPS is a temporary diet for people who need healing. It’s not, in my opinion, a lifelong diet. Dr. Campbell-McBride includes instructions in her book, Gut and Psychology Syndrome: Natural Treatment for Autism, Dyspraxia, A.D.D., Dyslexia, A.D.H.D., Depression, Schizophrenia, for how to reintroduce dairy products, legumes, and whole grains.
9. Paleo is Expensive
I can make a one-pound loaf of whole wheat sourdough bread for about 50 cents to $1. Compare that to anywhere from $4-12 for a pound of ground beef.
Dried beans cost around 25 to 50 cents after they are soaked and cooked.
If you’re in your twenties and you have a lot of disposable income, then sure, paleo is no problem.
But for a single mom who is struggling to put food on the table to feed her three kids, it’s another story. If she’s on the paleo diet, she’s not allowed to stretch meals with beans and rice and bread. Because it’s “not paleo”.
I’ve met plenty of people from Honduras and Mexico and Guatemala who grew up on rice and beans (and plenty of good fats and organ meats) who had no cavities or degenerative disease. Same goes for people from Russia and Slovakia.
Not to mention the healthy cultures that Dr. Weston A. Price studied. The Swiss who ate 50% of their diet as sourdough rye bread. Or the Scots who ate 50% of their diet as soaked oats. They were vibrantly healthy eating whole grains.
10. The Paleo Diet is a Waste of Time and Energy
I often see Paleo people on Facebook or Paleo Hacks arguing over whether or not honey is paleo. They proudly pronounce their disdain for milk and other dairy products, as “neolithic foods”.
I ask you, why do people sit around arguing about whether or not honey is paleo? Why not just go buy some honey at the grocery store? Or, better yet, a farmer’s market?
Why not just feed yourself with what is available, and then get on to more important things, such as inventing alternative energy sources or curing cancer?
Subscribing to an extremely rigid diet based on a load of misinformation and made-up ideas and sitting around defending it seems like a giant waste of time, especially when there are so many more interesting, valuable, and important things to be doing in the world.
I’m not recommending that we go out and buy boxes of Frosted Flakes. But what is wrong with soaked granola made with raw, local honey? My point is that there is a middle ground. We don’t need to travel back thousands of years to be healthy.
Want More?
If you enjoyed this post, you will enjoy this e-book by Matt Stone: 12 Paleo Myths. I read and loved it. I’ll be posting a review soon.
Update: I’m a big advocate of freedom of speech and believe in lively debate and sharing of opinions. That said, name-calling, fighting, and general nastiness will no longer be tolerated. I don’t have a comments policy posted anywhere on this blog, so I’m posting it now. Any comments that are disrespectful, rude, and/or contain foul language will be deleted as spam. If you get enough spam comments, your comments will no longer appear.
Disclosure: cmp.ly/4 and cmp.ly/5











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Wow! I was moving the notifications in my mail to another folder (since my inbox is flooded with them), so I did a search for them using “cheeseslave”. I was astonished to realize that you and I used to be friends in LiveJournal (in 2007) when you were ammichaels… and you pointed me to your new Cheeseslave journal at wordpress in a comment about raw milk in the naturalliving group.
I found this post while searching for something paleo related, I’m not a subscriber. I’m so sad you aren’t that person any longer- I really liked her, she really had my respect. But you don’t need to worry, I disagree with your dismissive tone and your inability to see how you’ve attacked others while complaining about being attacked yourself… so I won’t be following any other entries.
@Fancy
There is a big difference between this:
“I don’t eat Paleo and here’s why.”
Or even:
“I think Paleo is dumb so I don’t eat that way.”
And this:
“You are fat and stupid and wrong.”
The people who are calling me fat and stupid and wrong are attacking me personally. I’m not attacking anyone personally. Just saying I don’t agree with that diet and that’s why I don’t follow it.
It’s fine if you don’t want to follow the blog. I write it for people who like to read it.
Best wishes!
I like it, so I thank you for writing this post in particular, and the blog in general.
I have been vegetarian for ten years, and my friend became a committed paleo follower last year. It’s been a challenge to understand the mindset, but she seems to think it works for her, and I’m happy for her in that. I think you make an excellent point that I’ve read over and over in books, journal articles, magazines, and blog posts — follow a traditional food-based diet (rather than industrially-processed food-like substances), and you’ll be healthy. Inuit populations who eat high percentages of fats are healthy, and Latin American cultures focused primarily on beans and rice are equally healthy. That amazes and impresses me.
In conclusion, I’ll still follow your blog, so thanks for writing.
wow, unsubscribing. don’t need all this negativitey.
paleo happens to really work for a lot of people!
Yeah, Don’t want to get another point of view! Stay away from that
Bravo! All excellent reasons. My husband is an evolutionary biologist, and when he was reading about the paleo diet, he started getting really upset with their concepts of history. Humans *have* evolved to eat the products of agriculture– the lactase-producing gene, various genes for breaking down starches– and even before that, they were using methods of fermentation to make those foods accessible. Do people really think evolution stops and takes a break for a few thousand years? Our gut biota, especially, are able to evolve rather quickly (having short generations and all), and it would be absurd to think that they haven’t. Now, changes in the last 50 years? THOSE have been significant, and that is a different story.
I have no doubt paleo is an effective weight-loss strategy, but why is it that everyone who diets thinks they only diet that works is the one that worked for them, this time? I’ve lost weight on Atkins. I’ve also lost weight counting calories, doing ADF, using cognitive-behavioral modification… I know first-hand that lots of diets work great for losing weight. I also know that when you stop overeating, the reduced strain on your gut makes you feel better, sometimes dramatically. But losing weight is not the same as living a full life at a healthy weight.
I’m sure there are nice, moderate paleos, just like there are nice, moderate low-fat-diet adherents. But there are also a lot of extremists on every diet who act like they’ve obtained the secret knowledge (from the ancient past! Sexy!) and strength of will (like bronzed warriors of old!) that makes them better than those of us who would prefer to continue eating pie. And a lot of them do say scary things to warn you away from prohibited foods. Just like the low-fat crowd they so love to criticize. So props to you for saying it.
@Sadie,
Someone further up linked to this website and I’ve been exploring it since yesterday. I was just reading this article before reading your comment. I bet your husband would find it educational and he’d probably understand it better than I do. lol There is certainly a lot of scientific evidence supporting that idea that human beings are not well suited to grains (and beans), I’ve never seen it all put together in one place like this though. http://www.beyondveg.com/cordain-l/grains-leg/grains-legumes-1a.shtml
What a PHENOMENAL article! I highly recommend it to anyone who believes the fact that some cultures can consume dairy (because they produce lactase as adults) is in any way evidence that we could also have evolved in that same short time to eat grains healthfully.
There are calculations which estimate how long it took to increase the gene for adult lactase persistence (ALP) in northern Europeans from a pre-agricultural incidence rate of 5% to its present rate of approximately 70% [Aoki 1991]. (Note: The enzyme lactase is required to digest the sugar lactose in milk, and normally is not produced in significant quantity in human beings after weaning.) In order for the gene frequency to increase from 0.05 to 0.70 within the 250 generations which have occurred since the advent of dairying, a selective advantage in excess of 5% may have been required [Aoki 1991].
Therefore, some genetic changes can occur quite rapidly, particularly in polymorphic genes (those with more than one variant of the gene already in existence) with wide variability in their phenotypic expression. (“Phenotypic expression” means the physical characteristic(s) which a gene produces.) Because humans normally maintain lactase activity in their guts until weaning (approximately 4 years of age in modern-day hunter-gatherers), the type of genetic change (neoteny) required for adult lactase maintenance can occur quite rapidly if there is sufficient selective pressure. Maintenance of childlike genetic characteristics (neoteny) is what occurred with the geologically rapid domestication of the dog during the late Pleistocene and Mesolithic [Budiansky 1992].
The complete re-arrangement of gut morphology or evolution of new enzyme systems capable of handling novel food types is quite unlikely to have occurred in humans in the short time period since the advent of agriculture. Some populations have had 500 generations to adapt to the new staple foods of agriculture (cereals, legumes, and dairy) whereas others have had only 1-3 (i.e., Inuit, Amerindians, etc). Because anatomical and physiological studies among and between various racial groups indicate few differences in the basic structure and function of the gut, it is reasonable to assume that there has been insufficient evolutionary experience (500 generations) since the advent of agriculture to create large genetic differences among human populations in their ability to digest and assimilate various foods.
Of the population differences in gastrointestinal function which have been identified, they generally are associated with an increased ability to digest disaccharides (lactose and sucrose) via varying disaccharidase activity. Although insulin metabolism is not a direct component of the gastrointestinal tract, there is substantial evidence to indicate that recently acculturated populations are more prone to hyperinsulinemia and its various clinical manifestations, including non-insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus (NIDDM), obesity, hypertension, coronary heart disease and hyperlipidemia [Brand-Miller and Colagiuri 1994].
It is thought that these abnormalities, collectively referred to as “syndrome X” [Reaven 1994], are the result of a so-called “thrifty gene” [Neel 1962] which some groups have suggested codes for glycogen synthase [Schalin-Jantti 1996]. Consequently, the ability to consume increasing levels of carbohydrate without developing symptoms of syndrome X is likely genetically based and a function of relative time exposure of populations to the higher carbohydrate contents of agriculture [Brand-Miller and Colagiuri 1994].
There are no generally recognized differences in the enzymes required to digest fats or proteins among human populations. Additionally, all human groups regardless of their genetic background have not been able to overcome the deleterious effects of phytates and other antinutrients in cereal grains and legumes. Iranian populations, Inuit populations, European populations, and Asian populations all suffer from divalent ion (calcium, iron, zinc, etc.) sequestration with excessive (>50% total calories) cereal or legume consumption. All racial groups also have not evolved gut characteristics which allow them to digest the food energy which is potentially available in the major type of fiber contained in cereal grains. Further, most of the antinutrients in cereal grains and legumes (alklyrescorcinols, amylase inhibitors, lectins, protease inhibitors, etc.) wreak their havoc upon human physiologies irrespective of differing genetic backgrounds.
Thus, most of the available evidence supports the notion that except for the evolution of certain disaccharidases and perhaps changes in some genes involving insulin sensitivity, the human gut remains relatively unchanged from paleolithic times.
We all just want to ‘square the curve’, if you’re familiar with the term. (Gerontologist and longevity researcher Roy Walford, MD used it, if not coined it.) It just means dying relatively quickly with minimal discomfort no matter at what age. Longer life is better of course but not at the price of a long slow decline. So we know our species is marvelously adaptive to what’s available. Good news.
But I feel most of this conversation is of secondary importance in the face of the worldwide propagation of genetically modified seeds and resultant ‘phude’. Talk about NEW! Evolution-wise this is as new as it gets, for us, these current several generations, now eating transgenic phude daily. (I have a hard time sullying the word ‘food’ by putting it next to ‘transgenic’). To say the least, I’ve seen enough to be 100% convinced this is a failure in safety, a failure in yield improvement and a failure in nutrition improvement. And it’s sterilizing millions of acres of soil. But the momentum of this financial goliath is awesome and it literally controls the USDA and the FDA at this point. GMOs have already contaminated a huge portion of the food products that are mass-produced/mass-distributed; this process has metastasized globally for the last several decades. Bad news. So unless you have a food-related ailment already, there really is no time to continue tweaking an optimum diet when we are under such an insidious attack. What else can you call it? If you DO have a food-related ailment can you disprove it was exacerbated or even engendered by eating genetically engineered phude, especially if the timeline is congruent? Same with autism and all our other Top 40 diseases. We had best put our resources to personal defense, if not toward the efforts it would take to put the GMO and nuclear devils back into Pandora’s Box (according to the myth that’s impossible…). From research I’ve seen, my guess is that the most dramatic negative effects will show up soon, if they haven’t already, in the form of infertility 2-3 generations removed from the first unwitting consumers of transgenic produce and all the stealth additives made from them.
Here’s a straight-up report from the American Academy of Environmental Medicine: http://www.aaemonline.org/gmopost.html
It makes sense to me that if you want to follow the Precautionary Principle in regards to diet, you would not consume any GM food. The other choice is be a lab rat in the field.
Well… I went full-paleo in order to lose 20 lbs. It worked for me. However, I do agree that it’s expensive and impractical to maintain in the long term. Also, I love cheese… And milk, and have never seen a single reason why I should justify excommunicating them from my refrigerator. I understand why many people go full paleo. It seems to be a very healthy diet, but I don’t think all grains are bad if one doesn’t have a sensitivity to them. I would say my diet is 60% paleo. I try to get most of my calories from vegetables, meat, fish, and eggs (and fish eggs because, yum). Once in a while I still have a couple slices of pizza, and several times a week I indulge in a nice chunk of artisan sourdough with a big smear of ghee or butter or soft cheese. I keep my carbs low, because ultimately grains are really a filler food and offer a big hit of glucose (and the mineral-depleting phytic acid). I just don’t see the reason to avoid them entirely.
I think this entry is a little bit on the offensive. You can say why you don’t want to go paleo without attacking people who choose to do so (and have more willpower than you to give up cheese and bread). More power to them. I don’t have the willpower to give up grain, even though I know it’s not the most nutritious food and would be better replaced by more meat and vegetables and fats. Don’t judge people so hard, man!
I did say more power to them. See the post.
And I don’t think it’s my lack of willpower that is responsible for me still eating bread. I like bread and I think it’s good for me.
And I personally don’t believe that grain is any less nutritious than meat and vegetables.
Nutrient content is fully quantifiable. Has anyone ever shown you the difference between meat, veggies and grains? The data is easy to find and it’s easy to look at side by side. It’s one thing to not believe something that we can’t prove one way or the other, but nutrient density is EASY to prove. It’s not a matter of belief, Cheeseslave, when you put grains up against veggies, they are deficient, when you put them up against meat, they’re EXTREMELY deficient. Believing otherwise puts you in the realm of religion rather than truth.
@Fancy
Again, to repeat, Dr. Price found that a balanced diet that included properly prepared whole grains (up to 50% of the diet in some of the people he studied) was sufficient to feed people who were optimally healthy.
I don’t see why you feel the need to keep commenting on this post, trying to prove me wrong. If what you are doing works for you, keep doing it. But you are not going to convince me to stop eating grains.
Again, as I’ve said, let’s please agree to disagree. I’m not telling you or anyone else what to eat. I’m just saying what I eat and why.
@Cheeseslave:
“was sufficient to feed people who were optimally healthy.”
“Sufficient”? People who are “optimally healthy”. Do you think most people ARE optimally healthy? Is “sufficient” really good enough when our food sources are less nutritious now with the depletion of of our soil?
Does this somehow demonstrate that grains are as nutritious as veggies and meat? I don’t want you to stop eating grains. Frankly, I don’t concern myself with what other people eat. But many of your statements are simply false. I got a thing about letting falsehoods lie. So eat your grains, but don’t tell others that they’re just as nutritious as veggies and meat, they’re simply not.
People who eat a primitive style diet with the same number of calories as a WAPF diet cannot help but get MORE nutrition because the foods they eat instead of the grains are significantly more nutrient dense per calorie. That’s simple math.
@fancy, I find it interesting that you write “in the realm of religion rather than truth” as if they are mutually exclusive. I was going to bring up elsewhere the fact that wheat, barley, beans, and lentils are prescribed in the Bible (Ezekiel 4:9), so I’m happy to continue eating them, having faith that they are therefore healthful for me.
@gin, I totally agree! I’ve thought this for a long time. In fact, in Genesis we find that the Egyptians are storing up grain in light of a great famine in the land. This in the very 1st book of the Bible. Not to mention, a little later on, that the land God has promised to the Israelites is “flowing with milk and honey”. Our Creator obviously has instilled nutritional value in these foods. I use a lot of paleo recipes just because they are good and whole, but I don’t think I could ever be fully paleo. As the author of this blog said, I really like bread and cheese and have no ill effects from them. But, I do understand that we live in a fallen world and that not everything (grains, dairy, hearts and minds) are as they should or could be.
@Lindsey T — thank you for your encouraging response and elaboration on my idea. “Flowing with milk and honey” indeed (hopefully raw and unprocessed).
I agree! But the grains eaten in biblical times were way different than the grains we consume today. Ancient grains were non-hybrid and usually soaked/fermented before eating to improve digestibility. I think modern wheat is the worst! It has been crossbred and processed so much, in order to improve texture and yield. But in the process the harmful properties (such as starch and gluten) have been enhanced. These create inflammation in the body and lead to disease and obesity.
Just like the milk and honey was raw/unprocessed, the grains were healthier as well. And I’m sure the fact that people got a lot more exercise back then than we do today helped.
Bread isn’t good for you. Nobody is judging you for eating it. They’re judging you for judging them for NOT eating it. Grains protect themselves from being eaten by making themselves both difficult to digest through the use of the hull, and then by making themselves very slightly poisonous. They don’t want to be digested. If you swallowed a wheat berry whole, it would likely emerge unscathed and still be able to sprout later. Whole grains are full of the anti-nutrient phytic acid. This can be mitigated by proper sprouting, souring, or soaking, but there will always be low levels of phytic acid in there. I enjoy occasional grains, but I try to keep them occasional, and as a treat in crusts for pies, or the yearly birthday cake for a friend. As a treat, or whatever, I think bread is okay. Especially if the rest of the diet is excellent overall. The swiss DID eat lots of bread, but it was heavily fermented and soured, then topped with a large slice of grass-fed cheese which further mitigated any damage done from the bread. Most people do not have access to raw, grass fed dairy as is described in the WPF diet, so should largely avoid grains just to avoid the mineral depleting phytic acid.
Thank you cheeseslave for what IMO is a thoughtful and entertaining outlook on Paleo.
Julia, where your argument falls flat is that we have learned to utilize many healthy foods that in their raw form are inedible. Olives are an example, taro another. As has been noted, a grain sensitive person should avoid them, but they have been responsible for improving the live and health of countless generations from Asia and Europe to the Americas.
In moderation and lacking any particular sensitivities, all foods are health giving. Sheesh, even that smelly stuff Eskimos eat
Julia, I would love proof that “bread isn’t good for you”. What bread? How you do you know? What isn’t good about it? How do you know that just because it does something to your body that it also does it to mine? And what bread making process are you talking about? Did you know if you sprout wheat and make it into bread it basically turns the wheat berries into a vegetable? Did you know that einkorn wheat is completely chemically different from modern wheat and is amazingly full of nutrients and very low in gluten? The thing is, everyone believes their own source, but how many of us have actual proof through our own experimentation that something is BAD?
No it doesn’t. 50 calories of sprouted wheat contains about 50% RDA for manganese and 25% selenium. Everything else it contains is less than 10% of the RDA, most less than 5% and many 0%. A mere 100 grams of hazelnuts provides over 600% manganese. Compare it to most any veggie- red peppers for example- 50 calories of red peppers- almost 200% vitamin A, 600% vitamin C, 40% folate, 45% B6, 25% E… and on and on.
“Did you know if you sprout wheat and make it into bread it basically turns the wheat berries into a vegetable?”
@Todd
Granted.
But personally, I like eating my grilled cheese sandwiches on sprouted bread or sourdough.
Not on bell peppers or hazelnuts.
Every time someone questions the lack of nutrition, you defend it with what you “like”, when someone comments that it’s all about what you like, you defend it with nutrition. Well I like my grilled cheese on Twinkies. The fact is, you eat that crap because you like it. That’s all well and fine, most people eat what they eat because they like it. Is sprouted/fermented grain better than unsprouted/fermented? Probably. But the argument that grains are as nutritious as meat and veggies (and you made this claim) is completely false… and it doesn’t hold up under scrutiny. They don’t even come close in nutrient density.
@Todd
I honestly do not believe it’s crap. Twinkies, yes, but bread (esp. whole grain sourdough or sprouted), no.
If you do, that’s totally cool. You don’t have to eat it.
I don’t think everything is equally nutrient dense. But a balanced diet is what I aim for.
Best of luck and good health to you!
I would add too that according to idiom sources, the “phrase “more power to them/you” is not one of true support, it’s one that suggests their attempts are folly. It’s basically an insult wrapped up in complimentary words. That’s likely why most folks aren’t getting the message you think you’re sending.
@Fancy
I’ve never ever heard that before. I did not mean it like that. I really meant “more power to you!”
According to freedictionary.com it’s an idiom that is meant to express genuine support:
More power to you! – Well done!; You really stood up for yourself!; You really did something for your own benefit! (The stress is on to, and the you is usually “ya.”) Bill: I finally told her off, but good. Bob: More power to you! Sue: I spent years getting ready for that job, and I finally got it. Mary: More power to you!
http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/More+power+to+you!
Now you’re just being pedantic.
Uh huh, but ask the British is “bloody” means they have an injury.
When used after a comma, “then more power to you” can mean:
1. I couldn’t care less.
2. That’s your problem; you’re on your own. Face the consequences.
3. You are unreasonable.
1. If you prefer to use software which plays Yankee Doodle Dandy with every keystroke, then more power to you.
2. If you want to date Georgina, then more power to you. I would just check to see there’s not an ice pick under the bed.
3. If you still disagree with me after understanding how this sort of labor is treated in different parts of the world, then more power to you.
@Pegasus
That is not what I meant. I was not being sarcastic.
@Cheeseslave: I believe you, but understanding how others view that phrase may help you better understand why they find it so offensive in this case.
“And I personally don’t believe that grain is any less nutritious than meat and vegetables.”
I’m not sure if you’re being serious when you say this or not, but just in case….
Vitamins & Nutrients in bread:
http://freetheanimal.com/images/2011/09/500/Screen-Shot-2011-09-26-at-2.43.09-PM.png
Vitamins & Nutrients in beef liver:
http://freetheanimal.com/images/2011/09/500/Screen-Shot-2011-09-26-at-2.43.28-PM.png
Vitamins & Nutrients in salmon:
http://freetheanimal.com/images/2011/09/500/Screen-Shot-2011-09-26-at-2.45.13-PM.png
All pulled from:
http://freetheanimal.com/2011/09/wheat-how-about-against-the-grain-and-zero-servings-per-day.html
You can eat grains all you want, but you should probably avoid blanket statements like the one you made when trying to make arguments or seem credible at all.
This is one of the things that makes me crazy. You don’t like paleo, because you love bread and cheese so you dismiss it as a fad and send out all this misinformation. Well, paleo is about eating REAL food. Something that I *thought* you agreed with. Forget the evolutionary aspect, if you like, it’s about eating real food that doesn’t disturb your digestion or irritate. I’m glad you can eat bread and cheese with impunity. I can’t. I find it bloats me and makes me ill. I have been eating this way for over a year, I don’t find it in the least bit difficult. I simply say no to the things I can’t eat and yes to the ones I can. I don’t find it that expensive either. I find that eating bread and beans, just made me hungry an hour or two later. a small portion of meat with lots of veggies and grass fed butter lasts me a lot longer and isn’t that much more.
Frankly I don’t miss much of the foods I used to eat, especially now that I feel so much better and can think more clearly. I’m GLAD I discovered paleo.
@Mary-Anne
That’s great! If it’s working for you, keep it up!
Some people really need a paleo diet, which is fine. It is a real foods diet, which is the important thing. I tried paleo/primal eating for a while, and it completely trashed my budget. I was spending more money on food than I could justify (I have this thing called retirement that I need to plan for, and in this economy, saving as much money as I can has to be a priority). Also, I really didn’t see any difference between eating paleo and eating the whole foods diet I was eating before–which includes whole grains and legumes. Lately, I’ve become fascinated with the traditional diet of New Mexico’s Pueblo Indian tribes, after having spent a couple of weeks in New Mexico. These are people who have thrived for centuries on Indian corn (heirloom corns are amazing food plants–nothing like what is grown commercially today), squash, beans, tomatoes, peppers, and wild plants like cactus (cactus is one of the most nutritious foods on the planet). They ate meat when it was available, but they didn’t rely on it. They also took up herding sheep when the Spanish introduced them in the 16th century.
What really bugs me is when someone emphatically says “This –insert diet here– is the only true diet people should be eating!” That’s a load of hogwash. There are many types of healthful of diets. There is only one thing that we truly know about nutrition: It is the SAD of highly, processed food that is killing us. A traditional diet of whole grains, legumes, veggies, fruit, and the occasional serving of meat can be just as healthful and life sustaining as a diet of grass-fed/wild meat and veggies. Just as the Pueblo people of New Mexico.
I agree with you completely, Roxanne! I think the single most important thing is a diet of real, unprocessed, whole foods – in whatever form the individual chooses/prefers, or is dictated by the body. Surely that was the most exciting discovery of Weston A Price in his travels around the world – that many DIFFERENT kinds of diets can support full health and longevity? The one thing every healthful diet he observed had in common was that it was free from the “foods of commerce,” or in today’s speak, processed or adulterated foods. How amazing, really, that is! How blessed we are to each be able to choose what works for us, what we prefer, and be healthy?
Wow! If we can’t tolerate differences in oppinion on what we think is good to eat, what CAN we tolerate! I follow this website because I enjoy the insights into traditional ways of preparing food–not that I do so as much as I’d like. But reading the comments from these paleo diet enthusiasts has really shocked me! The anger is palpable–could it be their diet?
On another blog, you comment: “…Then I started eating the Weston Price way — cod liver oil, raw, grass-fed milk, butter, cream and cheese, pastured meats and eggs, organ meats, shellfish and wild seafood, fermented foods and drinks, and if I ate grains/seeds/nuts/legumes they were soaked and/or sprouted.”
And here you say: “And is bread really that bad for you? How can it be, when humans around the world have been thriving on it as a staple in their diet for over 10,000 years”
Croissants and sourdough certainly aren’t made from sprouted grain.
Make up your mind.
@Julia
We eat sprouted whole grain bread every day. I bake with sprouted flours, make pizza with it, bread and cookies, etc.
We eat croissants occasionally. I don’t keep them in the house but I would eat one if I were out at a restaurant or cafe.
Both croissants and sourdough can be made with sprouted grains. It isn’t that complicated to do.
@Grains Rock
You know that’s a very good point. I hadn’t thought of that but there is no reason why you couldn’t make croissants with sprouted grains.
Wow, this is just unbelievable. I must say that I haven’t read many of the posts because I just don’t have the time, but from what I have read I am so disheartened by. There are some nasty people out there. Don’t you paleo high horse people know that anger and venomous words are just as toxic as eating a squishy white piece of Wonder bread. It is amazing how brave people are behind the protective wall of the internet. Did you not really read her post. I saw several references to things that totally took her words out of context. Understanding should have started at the title which is “Top 10 Reasons I’m Not Paleo” Annmarie is talking about HER, not anyone else. She is stating HER reasons and she is not telling anyone that they must follow her or that they are wrong for not following her. So you vicious anger people need to get over yourself. In my experience the people who defend their opinion so vehemently are the ones who have internal doubts.
I have been on enough paleo sites to know that I don’t want go follow that diet but I have never, ever attacked anyone for their opinion. BE NICE, all you are doing is hurting people and yourself.
Not only is this post a lot of bad information and conjecture, it’s dangerous to those who are looking for information on a real food diet. Paleo is not low carb, grains are not only an unsustainable food source but have very little nutrient density. I was always curious as to the name ‘cheeseslave’. It’s obvious that since you do not have personal willpower to say no to cheese or bread, you defend your position by saying ‘hogwash’. If it’s not obvious to you how many people are helped by giving up bread, dairy, etc. and find it very easy to be ‘social’, then you’re missing something. But don’t make erroneous claims just because you ‘like bread’. Many people like cigarettes, that doesn’t mean it’s healthy no matter how much they justify it.
@Anthony
I said this to someone else but I’ll say it again, as it is worth repeating:
I don’t call this blog Cheese Slave because I have no willpower. I happen to love these foods and they make up a large part of my diet.
Dr. Price studied people (the Swiss) who at around 50% cheese/butter and 50% bread. They were optimally healthy. How do you explain that if these foods are so bad? You might want to read his book, Nutrition & Physical Degeneration.
Cheeseslave,
Dr. Price found this “optimal health” in a very small group of Swiss (Loetschental Valley), isolated from the majority. He concluded that their elevation and location provided them with unusually nutrient-dense foods (for their animal feed as well) and that this was as much a contributor to their better health as their isolation from modern foods. He also specifically mentions vegetable consumption.
He mentions too that using lime (an ancestral preparation method) in grain prep for bread in the diet of the “modern” Swiss did nothing to improve the rates of dental decay. This would suggest that the grains in the diet had little to offer either way.
I explain it this way- the remainder of their diet was SO nutrient dense that the void created by the grains wasn’t very significant. However, the larger, more modern Swiss population, eating the less nutrient dense diet couldn’t afford the void. The foods we eat today, even those pastured and raised organically, don’t come close to the nutrient density of the foods grown at those elevations.
Brigit, RD
@Brigit
Yes they did eat some vegetables but not a lot and only in the summer.
According to Mother Linda on the WAPF site:
“Their diet primarily consisted of dairy products (raw milk, butter, cream and raw milk cheese) from cows grazing on lush alpine slopes, and rye bread, or roggenbrot, from rye grown in the valley. They ate meat about once a week, usually veal, using all the parts and making soup with the bones, and some vegetables during the summer months.”
http://www.westonaprice.org/in-his-footsteps/switzerlands-loetschental
“I explain it this way- the remainder of their diet was SO nutrient dense that the void created by the grains wasn’t very significant. However, the larger, more modern Swiss population, eating the less nutrient dense diet couldn’t afford the void. The foods we eat today, even those pastured and raised organically, don’t come close to the nutrient density of the foods grown at those elevations.”
I’ve met lots of people from all around the world who have perfect piano key teeth with no cavities and no braces. People from Mexico, Honduras, Guatemala, Russia, India.
All of them ate grains. Lots of grains.
Some were even vegetarians (the Indians).
But they were usually (although not always) properly prepared whole grains as part of a balanced diet including grass-fed dairy, organ meats, bone broth, fermented foods, seafood, etc. Interestingly, they almost all took cod liver oil as well as kids.
The Indian vegetarians are especially interesting. The ones I met did not eat meat or organ meats or bone broth at all growing up. They only ate dairy products and eggs. But the eggs were pastured and the dairy was grass-fed. And they cook everything in grass-fed ghee.
Ann Marie/Cheeseslave,
I think perhaps I wasn’t making my point clearly, my apologies. Besides the direct vegetable consumption by the people, the animals that produced the dairy, meat and organ foods they were eating were ALSO eating a far more nutrient dense pasture- something that is a product of volcano activity, elevation and glacial waters, our food animals do not have access to.
I don’t doubt that. But you are talking about individuals and not entire cultures. Most of the cultures these folks belong to DON’T have good dental health in general- in fact they have some of the worst dental health in the world, making the individuals exceptions and not rules. I see people in my practice all the time who don’t have the “expected” problems associated with a poor diet, but that doesn’t change that their diet is poor. Here in the US, where most people eat a pretty crappy diet, there are people who are genetically blessed with hard teeth who boast perfect smiles. These individuals can’t be used to evidence the idea that the SAD is nutritious.
If they weren’t one of the lucky few with good genetics, they may simply eat nutrient-dense foods as the remainder of their diets. Dr. price doesn’t say these people were carie-free- he says he found one in three children with caries. We can assume that if it’s possible that the children eating this “ideal” ancestral diet could have decay, then there are also children who were eating the more modern foods, who had none.
They did eat eggs and dairy, though. In my practice, it is really only veganism that stands out as presenting severe nutritional deficiencies (apart from gut issues that may precipitate mal-absorption). So this doesn’t strike me as a strong counter-argument for eating grains.
I think that this point actually supports my argument about the nutrient density of the remainder of the diet. I think grains can be beneficial in many ways- they can add calories/energy to the diet, they can provide a good “pairing” for nutrient-dense foods like cheese and butter, and people just like them and some would be miserable without them. But in my opinion, the people that thrive eating grains are doing so despite their grain consumption, and because they manage to take in significant nutrition in the rest of their diets. For most people, a diet high in grains, even properly prepared grains, means a diet significantly lower in nutrients- so even those patients who include grains in their diets are advised to prepare them properly and limit them.
I know how much you love your grain foods, and I respect that. The importance of getting pleasure from our diets is often minimized by healthcare professionals. I understand that you believe the remainder of your diet is nutrient-dense enough to compensate for any possible loss, and you may be absolutely right.
A final thought, the majority Swiss population was still eating pastured meats, butter, eggs and dairy. Adding the lime to the grains they used for bread didn’t make any difference in the health of their teeth- they were also eating some refined sugar (as you say you do as well). That tells me that even though they were eating a diet far superior to anything we can get here today, they STILL had deficiencies caused by the foods displaced by the grains. Meaning that we are already way behind them nutritionally, even without the grains- and that we bump ourselves back even further when we include them. This is how I explain what makes grains so bad.
Brigit, RD
PS. Your daughter is absolutely ADORABLE and her resemblance to you, remarkable. (:
Grrrr… that’s what I get for having two WAP pages open at the same time.
Correction- he founds caries in-
A much smaller incidence, but not total elimination. If 1/3 of those eating the “modern” diet had caries, that means that 2/3 had none. That’s an impressive number, still.
I can’t believe that I’m even commenting here, but since when do people think that finding a blog with any information means it is good information? “It’s dangerous to those who are looking for information on a real food diet..” They should be looking for that information somewhere else, shouldn’t they, like with their doctor, nutritionist, homeopath, etc- not a blog. It’s her blog and she has the right to write her opinion, which is exactly what she’s done and anyone looking for the key to a perfect diet here is sadly misinformed. (No slam on you Cheeseslave, I just don’t understand why people have this belief that YOU need to be responsible to provide medically or scientifically based information.)
I liked this blog for a minute, but I think you’re a little over-involved in the comments. You don’t have to respond personally to everything everyone posts…
then why do you keep responding?
Unsubscribing from the blog doesn’t mean leaving the current discussion.
Most bloggers do respond to the comments left on their blog posts. What is strange is the way those of you who disagree with the post just can’t walk away, the way you guys keep responding to every comment, as if it were your blog.
I don’t always respond to comments but I do try to respond to as many as I can. It depends on how busy I am.
I can’t believe that Ann-Marie, a blogger, is now being questioned for responding to comments on her own blog. Seriously, people, you should be embarrassed. And if you’re not now, you will be in a few days when your anger finally subsides.
All I can say is wow. She responds respectfully to people who disagree with her post and now she is being criticized for that? Would you like it better if she just ignored all of you?
WoW! You seem to have really struck a nerve with some people. Ouch! I choose not to do any eating plan that I considere “extreme” and true paleo IMHO is. I also don’t take offense to anyone else thinking my choices are ill advised in any way. I don’t think it’s a good idea to hand pick a single part of a lifestyle from a culture or any part of history and try to adhere to it. I read somewhere that many of the western settlers (Little house on the Prarie) era people ate 4000 calories for breakfast. To take that eating plan and put it into a modern lifestyle seems foolish to me. Unless you are going to also integrate the exhaustive sun up to sundown physical work you won’t have the same health benefits. For me the same goes with the paleo diet, unless you are going to have periods of calorie deprivation, which would have been common during that period, because they would feast after a kill and go hungry until the next kill, how can you say you are being true to the period.
It’s too bad that someone would unsubscribe over your opinion of why you don’t choose to participate in particular eating plan.
Great points!
Hey Cheeseslave,
I’m so sorry to see all the negative backlash you are getting about this post. I thought it was very well-done and realistic. These days, there seems to be many dietary “fads” happening and it’s hard not to get sucked into all the reason why you *need* to execute them. As a mother of three (almost four), it’s tough just to be able to feed my family good-quality sprouted bread and raw milk. The raw cow’s milk in the store is very expensive so we settle for the raw goat’s milk from our neighbor’s goats in the backyard. For us, this is a sacrifice. If I felt I needed to restrict my family to only specific, high-priced items in order to maintain our health, I would be in a whirl-wind of stress and chaos and my entire life would be about the next meal we were going to eat.
Anyway, just wanted to say thank you for a refreshing post and that contains realistic motives without cursing anyone for the way they choose to eat and live their lives. Bravo for your bravery!
Thanks, Kyla
I wrote this post for folks like you — I just don’t think we need to get so crazy with this.
Kudos to you for working so hard to feed your family well.
Hi Kyla,
Please don’t feel you are “settling” for raw goat’s milk! I chose to keep dairy goats instead of a cow for our family’s milk because I strongly believe the milk is healthier. I find it curious that the WAPF seems to hold cow’s milk up on a pedestal considering goat’s milk is superior nutritionally and is a more traditional dairy product. In addition, goat’s milk is more easily digestible, doesn’t contain a certain troubling casein protein, is alkalinizing in the body (as opposed to acidic like cow’s milk and cow’s milk products…remember that cancer cannot survive in an alkaline environment). I don’t have to worry about butterfat either…my does have their milk tested and have a wonderful butterfat content of 5.2%. From a management perspective goats are also more adaptable than cows, more efficient milk producers, easier to handle, make it easier to collect milk in a sanitary way, and are very easy to keep in a relatively small suburban backyard. Some people think goat’s milk tastes bad…but that’s only because they’ve only experienced either store-bought (pasteurized & UHT milk) or milk from poorly managed animals. When handled properly, raw goat’s milk is wonderful, sweet, and creamy! When people try the milk from my Nubian goats, they react either in an anti-climactic way (“Gee, this tastes just like cow’s milk.”) or in a pleasantly surprised way (“Wow, this tastes so much better than the cow’s milk we normally drink!”).
Enjoy that wonderful raw goat’s milk!
This message is for Kyla: Kyla I’m just curious, why do you feel that drinking raw goat’s milk from someone you know as opposed to raw cow’s milk from the store is a sacrifice? Thank you
I was pondering this topic myself and my main disagreement (with Paleo/Primal) is that it is all based on false, God-dishonoring, evolutionary theory. Man was cultivating the ground from the time they were removed from the Garden of Eden (even before that God said that He gave them everything growing from the ground as food); shortly thereafter they were keeping livestock for meat, milk, and skins. If you have a sensitivity to a food you obviously shouldn’t eat it (and with all of the pollution and contaminants most of us are sensitive to something, even if it isn’t a full out allergy), but to say that man wasn’t created to eat it is ridiculous.
I agree with the FAIL of the basis of that way of eating. I think instead, of how Noah’s family would have eaten. I think *that* is the best basis for our diet. Wellness Mama has a great Christian blog about eating grain-free.
I have seen more of the hatred shown by some of the commenters here throughout the Paleo world. If you question them, you are a target. It’s as if Paleo is their religion. I enjoy the recipes and incorporate many of them in my diet, I just stay out of “the community”.
Also, Primal (Mark’s Daily Apple), though still flawed in the evolutionary theory, is a much wiser way of eating. They don’t disallow dairy.
@davetteB – Agree!
I think you need to re-read Genesis. Agriculture was part of the punishment of disobeying God “By the sweat of your brow will you have food to eat…” Agriculture (grains) is a LOT more labor intensive than just walking around the garden picking fruits and vegetables. Also, if you think about it, agriculture is what has caused poverty, inequality, slavery, etc. Look at hunter-gather societies, they don’t have these things.
Jessica, You need to re-read Genesis as well. Adam and Eve were not hunter-gatherers either, they ate what was in the Garden of Eden, all readily available to them, no work required and it was just plants, not animals. It was the toil of having to deal with weeds and working the ground that was punishment. Even a hunter-gatherer would have to deal with this punishment as he was not in the Garden of Eden and his food (wild animal, wild fruit, plants) came from the cursed ground. This is no way a base to say that paleo is the way to eat from Bibical standards. Paleo avocates eating unclean meats, pork, shellfish, rabbit and so on (Deut. 14:3-21). The curse of leaving the Garden of Eden is a direct result of sin and is a reminder to us that Jesus is our only salvation. Jesus ate bread, wine, and fish…and His disciples picked grain from fields they passed through and ate it.
Agriculture did not cause poverty, inequality and slavery, man did. We now have agriculture without slavery here in the states. Blame corporations like Coca-cola and giant food companies that sell there processed junk to developing countries. A poor African can buy a cheap Coke and pringles and hunger subsides with no nutrition all the while lining the pockets of the CEO. Organic, local and substainable agriculture is not the same thing, in fact using grazing, domesticaed animals on ground that cultivated and would otherwise go to waste would help to end poverty. And inequality is gone when one begins to live the book of Acts…read that and see how no one went without.
You need to re-read my comment. Nowhere did I say that Adam and Eve were hunter-gathers. I also never said that the Bible advocated a paleo way of eating.
For those commenting about grains in the Bible and for those interested in a bit of context/commentary on Ezekiel 4:9:
“Ezekiel 4:9 ”But as for you, take wheat, barley, beans, lentils, millet and spelt, put them in one vessel and make them into bread for yourself; you shall eat it according to the number of the days that you lie on your side, three hundred and ninety days.
BUT AS FOR YOU, TAKE WHEAT, BARLEY, BEANS, LENTILS, MILLET AND SPELT, PUT THEM IN ONE VESSEL AND MAKE THEM INTO BREAD FOR YOURSELF:
Why mix the ingredients all of which were common in Israel’s diet according to (2Sa17:27, 28, 29)?
The severity of the 18 month siege of Jerusalem would make it necessary to mix all available grain to derive sufficient material to bake into bread. Some modern references record that “spelt” is a species of hardy wheat regarded as inferior, since the hulled grains could not be freely threshed and which in some regions of the world is grown for feeding livestock. To be sure the final mixed grain produced a grade of flour inferior to pure wheat or barley flour.
Cooper notes that
“Wheat” and “barley” were the most important and widely used grains in the ancient Near East. “Beans” and “lentils” also were staple products usually not mixed with grain or used for flour. These four items, wheat and barley, beans and lentils, often are listed in pairs. “Millet” is mentioned only here in the OT but was used in Mesopotamia. “Spelt” sometimes was planted as a border to wheat or barley. ” (Vol. 17: Ezekiel. The New American Commentary. Nashville: Broadman & Holman Publishers.)
As alluded to above, the final siege of Jerusalem began in January 588 B.C. and lasted 18 months, during which the supplies of food became scarce. In times of scarcity in order to make the supplies last longer it was customary to mix several coarser grains (picture is of lentil) with the finer less readily available grains such as wheat and barley and grind these together to make flour.
“The outcome of this mixture would be a coarse, unpalatable bread, not unlike that to which the population of Paris was reduced in the siege of 1870-71. This was to be the prophet’s food, as it was to be that of the people of Jerusalem during …siege.” (Pulpit Commentary)
“If you live near a health-food store, see if they carry “Ezekiel Bread.” It is made according to the recipe that God gave Ezekiel. While it may not be palatable to those who are accustomed to refined sugars and flours, it is interesting to note that when made according to God’s recipe it produces a complete protein. God, the Creator of all things, knew exactly how to illustrate the reality of famine without jeopardizing the health of His obedient servant, Ezekiel!”
http://www.preceptaustin.org/ezekial_49-17.htm
Very interesting, actually. God is Good.
right on Allie.
DavetteB,
I am a Christian and run a paleo blog. I am not a fan of the emphasis on the evolutionary aspect mainly because I believe 1) it is unnecessary -there are better reasons to eat this way than because “we evolved” to eat this way- and 2) it alienates a percentage of the population who could benefit from eating this way but are turned off by the focus on evolution. Having said that, the bottom line is many of us eat a paleo diet because of food intolerance and/or auto-immune diseases. When I google a recipe and use the word paleo I know that I have a better chance of finding something that excludes the grains, legumes, dairy (in some, but not all cases) and lots of processed sugar that I (personally) do not want. So not all of us focus on evolution or eating like cavemen or “dishonor” God. Quite the contrary.
I think this is really the crux. Our food system is bastardized, poisoned, etc., and we are all burdened with heavy metals (more than we should be and are able to process.) In this case, eating the paleo way can be a good idea. If you don’t have any immune reactions to grains, nuts, beans, etc., then fine. And the people bringing up the Biblical aspect of things (as a Christian) is a good point. Yes, they were given bread and grains. Heck, in the era of W. Price, I can believe that they were healthy. However things have changed drastically in the last fifty years or so, and I think that what made people optimally healthy back then doesn’t work so well for today. Having said that, I cannot ignore that some people DO do well with grains. Better, even. I don’t believe that is the majority of American society, though.
@annie dru…I’m curious to know if when your mom changed her diet if she changed it from typical American diet or a traditional real foods diet to Paleo? Did she go low carb?
I’m 55 and my weight gain did not begin until age 51, only 5 lbs that year, 5 more each year until 55. I’m still peri menopause. Thyroid, adrenals and other hormones are wacked….a lot of this while on strict Paleo for over a year when I was 52-54. I only lost 5 lbs. of it on Paleo, then put it back on. I began Paleo when already on a real foods diet, so i wonder if that’s why i didnt lose as much as others. The weight would only come off from doing the Master Cleanse a few months ago, 10 lbs. have remained off since then. Most people who lose a good amount of weight on Paleo are coming out of a typical American diet.
I have noticed that women do begin to gain weight close to menopause and more after menses have ceased for over a year. They naturally begin to lose that weight in their 70′s. I have watched it happen to family members and many other older women I have known over the years. Just my observations.
Hi Allie,
My mom was not only overweight, but also ill. She had migraine headaches, joint and muscle pain, insomnia, fatigue and depression. She borrowed my Nourishing Traditions one night, read the introductory section, and then the next day she opened up her cupboards and fridge and had my dad haul garbage bag after garbage bag full of ‘food’ to the trash (as you can imagine, he wasn’t too happy about it at first!).
She replaced her stores with things like grass-fed butter, raw milk, sourdough bread (no she did not go paleo) coconut oil, calves liver (which she already loved) sauerkraut (which I made for her in the beginning) soaked and dried nuts, bone stock and kombucha (both of which eventually she also began making for herself). She’d always loved vegetables, but after reading NT, she made an effort to purchase only organically grown produce.
In addition to industrially produced foods, what she also let go of were ‘treats’ mainly because she didn’t seem to crave them any more. In four years I have yet to see my mom put a fork full of cake to her face. She has enjoyed the Almond Cookie recipe from NT when I’ve made them on holidays, birthdays, etc, and she enjoys homemade ice cream made with raw honey in the summer. Other than that, I don’t think sugar passes her lips.
She was 68 when she began her new program, and within a matter of weeks, literally weeks, she was 30 lbs. lighter and years younger in her mental outlook and energy level. The entire family was flabbergasted. Her two years younger sister battles excess weight, recently had her gall bladder removed, has had knee surgery and takes ‘the medications of the aging; blood pressure, cholesterol, etc, but my mom hasn’t had an operation and doesn’t take a single prescription.
She’s up at 5am every morning so she can drive to my brother’s house to care for his son and special needs daughter while he’s at work, as he’s a single dad. She lives alone and attends to all her own ‘life-maintenence’. These are things that would have been impossible for her before she regained her health.
My mom doesn’t hesitate a moment to credit her new diet with this transformation, and believe me, she preaches it to anyone and everyone she knows and loves who will listen, and who’s suffering like she once did.
A.
I love what you had to say about grains! Sprouted grains are loaded with vitamins, minerals, protein, and dietary fiber. I don’t know why the paleos are trying to compare the nutritional value of wheat to that of meat. A balanced diet doesn’t make us choose one or the other. There are nutrients in grains that we need, yet can’t get from meat. And there are nutrients in meat, especially grass fed meat, that we can’t get from grains. We need both. Thank you for having the courage to speak out against the current anti-grain fad.
and thank you for coming on board. love your title. do you have a blog? Grains really do rock!!
A balanced diet doesn’t make us choose one or the other. There are nutrients in grains that we need, yet can’t get from meat. And there are nutrients in meat, especially grass fed meat, that we can’t get from grains. We need both.
Hear, hear! I couldn’t agree more.
Please name one nutrient you can’t get from meat, fish, fowl, veges, fruits, and nuts.
Couldn’t agree more either.
“Sprouted grains are loaded with vitamins, minerals, protein”
How do you define “loaded”? They are definitely loaded with carbohydrate, and you didn’t even mention that. Truly though, how what kind of nutrient densty must a food have to be considered “loaded”?
“There are nutrients in grains that we need, yet can’t get from meat.”
Cool. Could you share what those nutrients are? More specifically, what do grains contain that we can’t get in greater quantity from vegetables? I’ve heard the claim before so I’ve researched it, and I can’t find anything that we need in grains.
Betaine.
Rodeo,
You wrote-
in response to Pegasus’ question-
You are mistaken- shellfish, quinoa, beets and spinach are ALL excellent sources of betaine- and are denser betaine sources than grains.
Brigit, RD
I agree with this blog post. The extreme rigidity of paleo and the lack of carbs in the form of grains (shock!) did my health no favours after about the 2 month mark. I actually ended up worse than when I began with more food sensitivities. Now I’m enjoying some fluffy white rice with no ill effect.
When we create rules around our diet it is a disaster waiting to happen. I was my healthiest when I ate what I wanted, when I wanted and yes I was always a healthy eater enjoying lots of variety, but I still had occasional cake, bread, sweets, dairy etc.. It’s when I started to restrict my diet that I began to have even more problems, and now I wish I never had.
id say a lot of paleo people eat dairy (for example, i eat butter as my main source of fat)
wheat and other grains are REALLY bad because of gluten and lectins and antinutrients. however rice and potatoes are “safe”, which means that i eat them as a convenient source of carbs, but they are not strictly necessary like meat and fat and vegetables are. im sure avoiding grains is pretty easy.
low carb is better for older, overweight people, because carbs break down to sugar which increases insulin resistance. high carb is better for younger, more active people. you can get carbs from vegetables, rice and potatoes.
after agriculture people can still eat meat, fruit and vegetables, but they can have grains as a backup plan. but grains as a significant proportion of a persons diet for the most part is bad.
I really appreciate this post, it shows that you are willing to change your opinions based on observation and new information. And you’re not afraid to tell people what you’ve learned and how it changed your thinking. That’s awesome. I did low carb for two years and though I lost 40 pounds and kept it off for the whole time it eventually really screwed me up. I gained it all back right in the middle and am having a heck of a time getting it off again even doing traditional. It’s taken me a year to recover from some of the health problems and still working on others. But at the time, I was all for it, my energy went up and the weight came off. Until I hit the physiological carb wall. I do have one paleo cookbook because it had some really tasty looking recipes in it and was recommended by a friend. I am still considering GAPS for an interim approach because I do have a child with behavioral issues linked to food. But I’m a closet foodie and severe restriction just won’t sit with me. I think Great-Grandma had it right all along: “Moderation in all things.” I recently found our local WAPF group and they’re great. I still take everything with a grain of salt though. Anything that feels too rigid gives me pause and makes me do research. i.e. A recent discussion with an herbalist about the true traditional way to consume raw milk made me reconsider how I purchase. I still love our raw milk and wouldn’t give it up, but now I strive to drink it within two or three days and don’t get more until the next milking delivery. This is because raw milk was not traditionally held under refrigeration for long periods of time and the biological profile is 80% dominated by psychrotrophic organisms by the 4-5 day. I’ve done my research on this and have a degree in food science, biology and chemistry. Traditionally, the milk was fermented or cultured after a day or so. Not refrigerated. So I have stopped letting my hubby have it after the first two days – he has a chronic lower colon problem that I don’t want exposed to a heavy load of those organisms. But up until that discussion, I was all for the benefits of raw milk up to the full pull date. So I appreciated the challenge and stretch to my scientific horizons just as I truly like this post!
If you don’t like a blog, just don’t read it. No need to be unkind!
PS. If you want to get angry over food…Let’s get angry a the fact that millions of people are literally STARVING.
Wow! I agree totally and you hit it on the head “balance is a good thing”. That’s my theory. We have evolved since tahat period in time. I enjoy your blog.
I’m sorry that you have been attacked by this post. Food and diets are such a touchy subject and is easily picked apart by many. I hope this will die down soon and everyone can relax and know that this was just a blog post explaining how you feel you should eat and why.
In La Leche League meetings we have a saying and that saying goes like this: “Take what you want and leave the rest behind.” This is what we all need to do when we read other peoples’ blogs.
One good thing I like about paleo is how it made me and my family eat more veggies. Because I took grains away, we had to fill that hole with something and it happened to be more veggies. However, we don’t eat paleo 100%. My family members wanted their breads and pizza back, but I stuck to making sure we all eat more veggies.
@jessica
You may want to read Genesis over – while in the garden they only ate “seed bearing plants” as did all of creation. Genesis 1:29-30. There was no death up to this point, not even for the animals, all ate from what God provided in the garden.
Adam did not hunt while in the garden, nor eat meat.
The ground and serpent were cursed, not man. Genesis:3:14-24
One consequence for man is that , now they “hunt and gather” food by the “sweat of his brow” instead of being able to just pick whatever they desire to eat as they had done before being put out of the garden.
It is clear in the Bible that grains are not a forbidden food.
Yeah, I never said they ate meat before the Fall. Gathering food is something that they would have still done before the Fall, so it wouldn’t have been instituted afterwards. Hunting is something that people regularly do for fun. So is gardening (fruits and vegetables). But have you ever heard of anyone growing grains for fun? No, it doesn’t happen, it’s back breaking work that historically the poorest have been made to do. It’s not something that Adam would have been doing in the Garden. Now this doesn’t mean we can’t eat grains anymore than not eating meat before the Fall means that we can’t eat meat. I think you read way too much into my comment based on your own perceptions of what Paleo is.
and flowing with milk and honey to go with it all
mmmmm!
Just a quick FYI. Regardless of your opinion or personal preference for a style of diet, a Paleo style diet is not a “fad”. It’s the original diet that sustained our species for maybe 100,000 generations. All other styles of diet are a fad because they’ve been nothing more than a tiny blip on the radar of our total culinary history.
I am 71. I rarely comment on blogs, but read several. When I read this post I smiled and enjoyed the obvious humor and good writing. I do not understand the vitriolic comments and extremely rude remarks of several people.
I have lived through butter, olive oli, and carbs being our food enemies. Diet and food hates come and go like waves and trends. While I kept enjoying olive oil and butter and shunned margarine, I was told it was not healthy. I did what made sense to me. I never told anyone else to do what I did. Since when have diets and ways of eating become like fanatical religions? We live in a country where free speech allows people to have their own opinions. However, extreme negativity and nastiness are just rude and uncomfortable. Eat what you want, when you want. We are fortunately to live in a country with all kinds of food being available and plentiful. Don’t become my food police and I won’t become yours. Do what makes sense to you based on all of the wonderful choices and abundance in this country. But stop being negative, insulting and rude!
@annie dru – real food makes the difference!
Happy for your mom!
Great post Ann. I do have to say that the way I eat is somewhat Paleo, and it isn’t expensive at all, at least the way I do it. I don’t eat a lot of meat, so that’s one way. Also, I can still have chocolate chip cookies, cakes, pies – I just make them with almond flour or coconut flour.
I definitely support your way of eating, and will continue to subscribe. I think we can all learn things from different ways of healthy eating, as no one way is “the right way”. Instead of complaining about food, we should be grateful we have a choice in what we will or will not eat.
I disagree strongly that it’s expensive and impractical. I eat a near-archevore diet with my family of 6 and do so without spending more than we did before. If anything, we’re spending less seeing that we don’t have to rely on allergy medication for our kids like we did before. Further, the long-term costs of the Standard American diet are far more expensive than the costs of our near-paleo diet.
Paleo is low carb? Really?
And Paleo is impractical because who has time to hunt and gather? Who said you should hunt and gather to eat Paleo food?
Seriously!
Eat what makes you feel good, don’t eat what makes you feel bad, and adjust your carbs to a level that is healthy for you.
This is how I eat, which, to me, encompasses the whole issue. Some people can eat certain foods with no problems (and thrive, not just survive), while others get deathly ill eating the same food. Some people can eat higher carbs (and thrive, not just survive), while others gain weight, develop unhealthy blood levels, develop diabetes, etc.
Arguing about the nutrient density of food (among real foods), and what to eat based on that, is actually a personal argument because we are all genetically different. Ultimately, that is a personal decision for each person. If eating a lower percentage of higher nutrient dense food is the choice that someone makes because it makes their life overall better for them, we need to respect that choice; they know their own body better than anyone else. If a person is healthy and thriving, why waste time arguing over percentages? Even Gary Taubes acknowledges that genetics plays a role in how many carbs a person can handle without ill effects, and based on one’s health, may need to adjust it up or down. The science out there is not to argue that ALL people should eat a low carb diet, but, rather, explains how hormones, enzymes, etc. work. How the hormones, enzymes, etc. plays out in the body will be different for each person. The science is there for those who need to make changes, to help them understand what changes they may need to make, and why. Low carb is just another valid way of eating. Insert whatever word you want for how a person eats…Paleo, WAP, GAPS, low carb, high carb…and the bottom line remains the same – if a person is healthy, thriving, and happy with their diet, then it is the right way of eating for them; not better than or worse than any other “diet”.
If eating low carb (with or without grains) was a universal truth, then everyone would do well on that diet, but that’s not true. I’ve seen people do great on low carb (with and without grains), and I’ve seen people’s health decline on low carb (with and without grains, eating healthy, whole foods, not low carb crap). Obviously, there are reasons science has yet to understand about these differences in individuals, but they are there, and cannot simply be dismissed out of hand.
I know that paleo is not low carb, but can be, so you can insert the word paleo in the place of low carb, and the issue remains the same. What one person thrives on will be different from what another person thrives on. We are all genetically different to think otherwise.
Here’s a blog I think would would enjoy, paleo or not, called Paleo for Women.
http://www.paleoforwomen.com/
First off, I think you knew when you were writing this blog that it would create controversy and invite comments and bring people to your blog. Well done!
There is no way I can read or will read every comment posted but from what I have read both sides are totally ridiculous and both sides are being rude, idiotic fools to each other.
Paleo is not a diet but a way of eating, just like Weston Price ideas are a way of eating not a diet. When I say “diet”, I mean in todays definition of diet. Eating a balanced, clean, whole food palate is what is the healthiest way to go.
You are very supportive of the GAPS diet for many reasons, but many people go on Paleo for the same reasons that they go on GAPS. There is nothing wrong with it.
I went on Paleo to heal myself and I did and what I found out is I cannot tolerate cheese in any form but I can drink milk. I cannot eat wheat without my mouth breaking out in sores and my skin in a rash, even sprouted grain items. I have been able to go off of all medications. I have lost 35 lbs. and am healthier ant 44 than I was at 24.
I believe the reason people are up in arms about your post is because you are so dismissive about it all and actually come off sounding like you think anyone who follows Paleo is an idiot. With that said, I do agree that there are way too many people who are paleo perfectionist.
Here is a great post by on a paleo site that speaks to this very matter.http://balancedbites.com/2012/06/paleo-perfectionism.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=paleo-perfectionism
Everyone should be able to get along and be open and accepting to what others do.
IMHO
Yes, indeed.
This has been an entertaining ride. Many interesting comments — I love to hear about other peoples’ experience — and a bit of unnecessary rudeness, definitely not all on one side.
Clearly, one diet doesn’t fit everyone. Thank goodness. We are all free to disagree. I aim to keep learning and growing, and to that end, I will continue reading this blog, because I’ve learned a lot here. Unfortunately, not much about the paleo movement, but for that I have other sources, here: http://bit.ly/LG7JZN.
Have you ever read It Starts with Food? Sounds like you should read it and the studies in the appendix. This is one of the most uneducated post I’ve ever read on this blog. So disappointing. Unsubscribing.
You really should take the time to educate yourself about something before writing a blog post about it. I honesty don’t mean this as an insult but you display a lot of ignorance here about what the Paleo diet actually is and how it is applied. You are misleading your readers by not giving a fair representation of the Paleo diet. Try reading a few books on the topic. I suggest the Primal Blueprint by Mark Sisson, The Paleo Solution by Robb Wolf or a great new book called “It Starts With Food” by Dallas and Melissa Hartwig. A lot of great information can be found within these pages and might just open your mind a little.
The paleos talk about Dr. Leila Denmark being their hero. She died at 114 and was a practicing physician until age 103. She didn’t drink milk. I’ve been trying to find out more information about her diet. Does anyone here know more? I guess it’s a co-incidence that she didn’t drink milk, because plenty of people on a traditional diet around the world have lived to 100 or older.
I thought this posting was quite entertaining and meant to get people upset. I would consider myself Paleoish and before I started eating this way I thought the same way you did. I worked out with crazy Paleo people and thought they were insane and flawed. I ended up getting very sick. I couldn’t play with my children. I was depressed. I was fainting all of the time. The doctors were sending me to all kind of specialists. They thought I had lupus. I only started to feel better when I went Paleo. I ended up having Hashimoto’s and a few deficiencies. I also just found out that I possibly have thyroid cancer. I think the reason people are so passionate about this type of diet is because those of us who don’t do it for weight loss feel like it saved our lives. I can play with my children again. I can think straight again.
For the record, my children eat pizza and cookies, but not in the same way others do. Paleo parents make it work and we don’t deprive our children.
I will say that I use to absolutely love cheese, but my body didn’t. Good for you that you don’t have the same issue.
I am not understanding why this many people care what you think- enough to comment to the extent that they have- repeatedly. Shame on you for saying what you think and your ‘dangerous conjecture’ on your blog Cheeselover! I think they also missed significance of the title of this post and your name, which I find hilarious. Do they seriously think someone named Cheeselover is going to support paleo?! Anyone that goes to a blog thread to learn about diets is going in the wrong direction anyways. That should be your first clue you are doing it wrong, second the fact you are doing a diet called paleo yet cooking your meat. Learn to coexist people, not everyone is going to have the same viewpoint as you. It disturbs me too how this paleo idea is sweeping the nation. There have been several diets identical to this one fizz out so I expect the same to happen. And newsflash!!! Eating healthy fresh foods low in carbs and grains is not something new! Secondly, there are literally millions of other nations that have subsisted on grains as the majority of their diets for centuries that are 100% healthier than we are.
My take on the paleo diet is that it is about eating healthy whole food, that hasn’t been overly processed (like wheat turned into flour, for instance), or laden with preservatives, or loads of sugar. You’ll have to do your own research on this, but I read somewhere that back in the mid to late 1800s, the average comsumption of sugar was around 12 lbs. per year. Now, the average consumption is closer to 160 lbs. That’s what’s doing us in, but if you want to eat your cakes, and pies, and cookies, be my guest. A paleo diet is impractical, but taking part of it along with eating fresh vegetables and fruit, drinking lots of water, and taking a good multi-vitamin, is a good thing. Another thing, hunter/gatherers became agrarians, which the central americans were already doing, i.e. growing corn, beans, chiles, etc., and north americans might have followed the same trajectory given an opportunity.
@wapf groupie – is this really how you disagree with someone? Wow.
Crazy rude AND ugly AND yes, maybe tomorrow will be better for you and then you can humbly apologize.
Hope you get some sweet sleep tonight.
How very sad that you have such a misinformed view of the Paleo diet/lifestyle choice, and quite a few other things might I add! You really shouldn’t be making statements without the evidence to support your views, as you are doing exactly what you claim you will not accept and tolerate yourself! Your blog has just lost another follower…
Interesting. You could have called this ‘The Top 10 Misconceptions About Paleo’ also. There are hard-core zealots out there, for sure. But most paleo eaters view it more as a framework, not as a re-enactment, and tweak it to fit their personal needs/wants. It sounds like you’re railing against zealotry – so do a lot of ‘paleo bloggers
A clarification on points #6 and #7 – There are modern hunter-gatherer groups, too. They didn’t “die out.” As for whether their lives were/are easy, it all depends on your definition of easy. Anthropological studies show that hunter-gatherers work about 15-20 hours per week foraging and hunting, with the rest of their time spent in leisure and household chores. I don’t know about you, but I’d love a 20-hour workweek. It sounds pretty relaxed compared to my current 60-hour workweek. And I’d get to eat whole foods?
This of course is neither here nor there on the discussion of paleo diet, as paleo diet and hunter-gatherer lifestyle are quite different things (one can easily produce paleo foods in a sedentary agrarian/horticultural setting), but I did want to share since a lot of people still have misconceptions about what life is like for these groups.
Oh you are bound to get some interesting comments about this topic, to be sure. I agree with some of the things you say and disagree with others. C’est la vie.
I loved this post, and you’ve gained an subscriber to your blog!
Have you read any paleo books? The easiest one to start with is probably the Paleo Solution by Rob Wolf. Please do, because a lot of the assertions you’ve made about what paleo is, and why people eat that way, are just plain wrong. The paleo diet is not motivated by what we ate thousands of years ago – that was the inspiration for the investigation into WHY it is that modern hunter-gatherer societies and our ancestors were so much healthier than us, why they managed to avoid any of today’s degenerative diseases. There is a LOT of science behind why one should avoid grains and dairy and sugar.
None of the people I know that do paleo are trying to be historical recreationists. They are all convinced by the science of what goes on in our bodies. Google some videos of Matt Lalonde, Harvard PhD in Organic Chemistry, if you want to take a few minutes to research your assumptions about what paleo actually is. (Honey is allowed in small quantities, by the way, and dairy can be reintroduced once the gut is healed…and the diet is primarily for nutrition, weight loss is just a nice side-effect. It’s not even a low carb diet like you said, as you just replace the carbs from grains with more nutrient-dense carbs from tubers and vegetables.) Do some more reading maybe?
There may be a lot of science, but much of it is flawed or one sided. What about the traditional Native American farming tribes of the America’s? They have thrived for centuries on growing corn, beans, squash, and other veggies, as well as foraging for wild foods and hunting. They ate meat when it was available, but they didn’t rely on it. These people, when living on their historical diet, don’t suffer from modern diseases that the SAD causes, have low rates of cancer, and live to ripe old ages.
So what about that? Hmmm? It is eating whole foods, no matter what type of eating that might look like, that is life and health sustaining, and it is the SAD diet of highly processed foods, too much sugar, and too many additives that is killing us.
Too many people around here insist on throwing out the baby with the bathwater.
Any response from Cheeseslave about all the controversy surrounding this article? I’d like to read one.
Great article Cheeseslave and well-written.
Tyou for posting this! I lost 135 pound on basically the zone diet and doing crossfit which for crossfitters paleo can work becaue of the okayness of fat metabolization but now thatt I am a competitve olympic weightlifter I was not able to lift heavy as I wanted and the nutritionist with a masters degree mind you as opposed to thesse paleo people who have opinion and not education said oh no u need to get off paleo and put me on a healthy diet including dairy and whole grains and I have to say I felt soo much pressure on paleo it mad me nuts so I am glad I have variety in my life and am muchh happier I also hid all the paleo elitests off my fb. I say if you want to know exactly what to eat see a registered dietician or nutritionist way worth the money!
Thank you for this! I had my family on GAPS for 3 months last year (to help me detox after 30 years of the usual American diet, and detox us all of lead poisoning), and since then I’ve tried doing a mostly GAPS diet, with grains as a treat now and then. I had TONS of energy (a plus with kids 6, 4 and 3!), and our immune systems were stronger than ever. But I’d been thinking lately that having soaked, fermented grains more often really can’t be that bad. I lost sight of the fact that GAPS is a temporary thing! And I had looked at paleo lately, too, but I like your perspective about it. It really validates what I’ve been thinking!
The price thing is such a big thing, too. We were going broke on food with that diet! We’re low income, I stay home with the kids, and we just can’t afford to spend a lot. So we joined a CSA and upgraded to raw milk last month, and the trade off was eating a lot more grains because they fill out our diet for less money.
Also, thanks for the reminder about the 80/20 rule! I’m finally getting that down, and I don’t freeze in horror if someone gives my kids graham crackers. The book “Bringing Up Bebe” also reminded me to have balance, and to give my kids healthy, responsible desserts to give them balance. I don’t want them gorging when Easter and Halloween come around because they never get treats!
Also, thanks for the reminder about the 80/20 rule! I’m finally getting that down, and I don’t freeze in horror if someone gives my kids graham crackers.
I think so many of us can relate to that look of horror. My husband is so much happier now that I’m a lot more relaxed about our diet.
There is a much better atmosphere in our house since I have relaxed my “food nazi” attitude.
Yeah, my family is enjoying a much more peaceful atmosphere too because of me loosening up! It was so hard to really get it through my head that when we’re out and people give us treat foods, it won’t send my kids hurtling into sickness and bad health. For some reason it was so extreme in my mind before. I like being able to shrug things off now!
I watched a couple of documentaries about the remaining hunter-gatherer tribes and quite frankly, they are diminutive, have bad teeth and do not have figures anything like the paleo-fantasy. Every great civilization in history has been powered by breads, beans, rice, milk and cheese. Nuff said.
@Frances
Matt Stone has some great pictures of short paleo folks with pot bellies in his book, 12 Paleo Myths
We don’t need to search for short, pot bellied people WAPFers, though do we? We see them EVERYWHERE, even in our favorite blogs. Ahem.
At the end of point #2 you say that you’ll write more on the flaws of the modern wheat theory when you’re finished reading the book… Which book are you referring to?
Thanks for the great post.
@Jessica Wheat Belly
Well, I think “hogwash” is a little presumptuous, but as I haven’t begun to read it I have to point out just one series of posts by Dr. Davis: einkorn bread. I don’t doubt that if your biome and your gut are perfect you can eat properly prepared gluten-grains, I just think those two suppositions aren’t so common in the occidental population and a less dangerous approach is to not eat them. I am personally not fanatically committed to paleo (certainly for the same reason as you it seems: I love hard cheeses
) nor primal. I still occasionally eat some wheat but not on an usual day (and if I would feel some re-exposure sign I would skip those), and I certainly eat white potatoes and white rice, a la Perfect Health Diet, and some orange juice (a la Peat) at breakfast time half of the days; pre-soaked legume less often.
What do I want to say? Some more of Tom Naughton’s spirit should be advisable: you have to look for what works for you, and everyone should just try first stopping to eat industrial crap to check for any changes. And look for the common ground more than the differences: more well prepared food and less omega-6 industrial food.
Best regards!
PD: Some people are not short on imagination for calling you fat.
You know what’s funny? This is the exact reason I don’t tell people that I eat paleo anymore because everyone on here supporting this lifestyle, and everywhere else most of the time, sound like a bunch of looney obsessed, preaching whack jobs. I mean seriously, take the time and actually read and listen to yourselves!? You all take this shit way too serious and way too far (I’ll be waiting for the “Nothing is more important than your health!” replies for that one), to the point that I hate being involved in the Paleo community. You all make it sound like we have not evolved at all, and that eating Paleo actually makes you stupid and can’t think for yourselves. As long as you eat meat, fish, veggies, full and healthy fats, and workout 2-3 times a week, everyone will stay healthy until the day they die. Speaking of which, our ancestors have been processing and consuming grains for thousands of years, and you know what!? We are still here, living, thriving, and growing old and that isn’t going to change no matter what. And unless your full blown Celiac, eating grains every once and awhile is not going to kill you either. I bet if 90% of you never had switched to living a Paleo lifestyle that you would all still end up living full and healthy lives in to your 80-90′s +. @Cheeseslave, thanks for posting this, your points are valid and it brought out the Paleo idiots from their socially deprived CrossFit communites, especially the ones that sound like they constantly post the stupid questions and answers on Paleo Hacks. Oh and by the way, my fiance and I eat paleo 80-90% of the time, but we also like to live and enjoy our lives to the fullest, so if that means enjoying a really good IPA or eating a really good slice of pizza or Turkey club sandwich, then so be it. I’m going to enjoy life, and I’m starting to realize that living Paleo seems to take that away. I await your null and unexciting responses, sheep.
Really enjoyed your comment, TJ!
You don’t have to be full blown celiac to have to remove grains. Just thought I’d correct you on that. A lot of people with Autoimmune issues do best when removing grains. I thought I handled them well too until I removed them from a diet. It changed how I felt immensely. So yes, if you can eat them, go ahead. But after having been in the Autism, Down Syndrome, generally sick community, I can tell you that a LOT of people do better removing grains, at least until their guts heal up.
@Julie Leonardo
I agree, some people do need to remove grains for a period of time. I just don’t think it has to be a life sentence.
For me personally, I reversed my rheumatoid arthritis and chronic fatigue syndrome and I only had to remove gluten for about 2 years. I kept eating rice and corn and other grains. I also took sugar out of my diet.
How about we all just agree on the point that we should eat things that are actually FOOD?! That way, we can all decide what’s best for our body and our family, since we are all different! Seems reasonable to me!
By the way, I thought this post was very informative and interesting – and freeing!
I’m looking for the “like” button! ;D Well said Melissa!!!
PS: I want to add to all the paleo lovers out there that in my 7 months of paleo I began to have worse and worse mood swings on a nearly daily basis. No matter how I adjusted my protein/carb intake or rest or all the other recommendations, the mood swings continued. Finally my husband told me I had to try adding wheat back in and so I ground up some fresh einkorn and baked. Instantly over night I was calm and happy. Now if I go more than a day without wheat the mood swings come back!! I never had this problem before paleo
We have been paleo for the past 7 months and I couldn’t agree with you more. We are Christians and believe in Creationism and therefore believe agriculture has been around since Adam and Eve left the garden. But all that aside, I have an answer to your baked goods dilemma. It’s called Einkorn. It’s the original God-designed wheat with only 14 chromosomes and a very gentle non fraken-gluten
. The wheat we have today has over 40 chromosomes and a very harsh gluten: which is why we have so many problems with eating it today! So you’re right, if it’s worked for so long, why can’t we eat it? Cause it’s been modified into oblivion for easier growth and resistance by farmers. So buy yourself some einkorn, grind it up, and enjoy those baked goods
. PS: I like cheese too. yuuummm.
Wow, fascinating about the Einkorn wheat. I have never heard of it, but am grateful to have learned about, and thank you for sharing!
Amazing, Melanie, I can’t wait to try it! Thanks again. Thanks for all your other great comments, too. I enjoyed your thoughts. : )
Thank you for sharing that Melanie! I refused to avoid gluten at one point (even though I knew I had a gluten intolerance) because well, the Bible talks about bread very frequently. I was confused and thought, but surely our Creator was right. Wheat can’t be bad for me! Then I found out that the wheat we eat today is way different from the wheat talked about in the Bible.
Allegra, I had the exact same problem. There is even an account of Christ plucking heads of grain from the stalk and eating them raw! So all the stuff about them having to be “traditionally prepared” by soaking or sprouting, I just didn’t agree that was necessary but I knew something was off. Finding Einkorn wheat made me feel so much better about including grains back in our diet. There are some great utube videos about Einkorn too
I forgot about the part where they actually ate the grains raw! awesome.
WOW! Seriously people – I thought the point of reading a blog was to expose yourself to new ideas. If I read a blog and don’t agree with it or think it won’t help me, I click the close button on the browser window and move on to the next one. I don’t attack the blogger.
Cheeseslave – I do like your posts and continue to read them, although I must admit I don’t agree with you 100% on everything in every way
. But – that’s OK.
As for everyone else, anger over reading about someone’s opinion of a diet/lifestyle that no one is forcing you to follow is simply silly. Peace and calmness be with ya’ll.
What a great comment! Just thought I’d point that out
I agree with Kendahl – great comment, Linda.
I have to say I think it’s kind of funny how upset these paleo/primal people are getting and thinking you’re being mean and judgmental. What I saw was a very honest thought-provoking post simply explaining why you choose not to eat a certain way. This is my first time here but I will be back, thanks for writing!
I generally like your posts…really I do. But this one is surprisingly hostile. You act as if people are telling you the way you eat is wrong and you should eat paleo instead. Well, I think there is room for diversity in this big old world of ours.
I have MS. I can’t eat bread, sprouted or not. I can’t eat cheese, raw or not. I can’t even eat eggs, sadly. They all make my symptoms unbearable. I make paleo cookies and cakes and pies, because I have to and they are pretty good. I grow and eat plenty of fruits and veggies which give me a good dose of carbs and if I still feel I need more carbs, I’ll eat some grain free, dairy free chocolate chip cookies, yumm. I have kids, I still feed them cheese and sourdough bread. Just because their mother has to be paleo doesn’t mean they don’t get diversity in their foods.
No one HAS to go paleo. Even if health concerns call for it, it’s not a dietary style being forced on anyone. No one has to start hunting and gathering. No one has to read paleo blogs, or keep up on paleo hacks, etc.
I get so sad when I read a post like this. You have tried to beat to the ground the one thing that I have found to actually help me in my MS fight. I am happy for you that you have a choice. That you can still eat bread and cheese and eggs. But maybe paleo is one topic you should leave behind. We get it, it’s not your thing and that’s perfectly ok. I’d much rather read about a topic on your blog that you really like, not one that you really seem to hate.
Well said Heidi!
With respect After reading this blog & all the comment, I was thinking, Why not take a challenge? Many people such as myself have been through many diets in the past. I was a vegan for yrs. I took the 30 day challenge back in 09 & to my skeptical surprise, little by little I started feeling great. Fat lost & muscle gained, no knee or joint pains, took more of the good fats in. Eat only when hungry, sugar attacks gone. Researched & was amazed. Yet take the challenge. See for yourself & post your experiences. I think everyone would see it fair & reasonable & you may change your point of view. Why talk about a topic so convincing if you never tried it yourself? Only time will tell. Im not saying this in a disrespectful way. You never know until you’ve tried it yourself. Paleo lifestyle isn’t a fantasy if many people experience real health benefits, have stronger immune systems & rarely get sick like most. We can eat what we want but our consequences will be illness & medicine.Take the challenge.
I tried to be a vegetarian, but found it too carb heavy (for me – I don’t do soy). Always hungry again shortly after eating; often suffered from gas and indigestion; and suffered from constant cravings. So switched to Paleo – have to admit that I did feel better physically and no longer craved in-between meal snacking, but I dearly missed dairy and grains. There are good, as well as bad, aspects to both diets. I truly believe, though, that the secret to eating healthy and to attaining and maintaining a healthy weight is to just use real food – be it meats, produce, dairy or grains. I only buy bakery bread with less than 5 ingredients; butter with 2 ingredients (cream and salt); I use fresh veggies and fruits; real dairy and meat/poultry products without preservatives, hormones and all the rest of the bad stuff. And I’m no longer afraid of fats (butter, whole milk, etc.) – that’s what keeps you satisfied! There are no boxed foods in my kitchen and no preservatives, no GMOs, no MSG (including the hidden stuff), and no “natural flavors” (what the hell is that anyway?!?). Everything real and in moderation – that’s my new diet. And yes, that includes home-made pie a la mode with REAL ice-cream once in awhile! Takes a little more time to prepare and a little more advance planning, but is SO worth it in flavor and satiety.
I really enjoyed this post, cheeseslave! Don’t agree with everything in it, but then again I don’t have to. I love a good discussion. I happen to believe that there are different ways of eating, but for the most part, the key is focusing on eating real food and avoiding all these chemicals, sugar, and food additives. I take a little inspiration from one diet, and a little from another diet, and so on, but ultimately do what works for me.
@Allegra
That sounds very healthy and very reasonable!
Here’s an explanation for the sudden, seemingly out of nowhere, gluten intolerance, that resonated with me.
http://nourishedmagazine.com.au/blog/articles/bread-dread-are-you-really-gluten-intolerant
yes. Something can be good for you or bad for you, depending on how it is processed/prepared.
Thanks for writing this honest and sensible post! I found you via Food Renegade. In reading through the comments I’m amazed at how angry people get over someone else’s opinion, and an opinion YOU wrote on YOUR blog:) I’ll be interested to read your review of 12 Paleo Myths. Glad I found your blog!
I am familiar with the Weston A Price Foundation and the Paleo diet and I find your arguments pretty weak ie Paleo diet is a waste of time and energy? Really, that is a very blanket statement about the purpose of everyone’s lives and what they do with their time. Does diet really have anything to do with this? And, just because it may cost more money, doesn’t mean it isn’t a healthier diet. In terms of practicality, shopping and eating on a paleo diet isn’t any more difficult than picking up a box of Pop Tarts, in fact I find I spend less time in the kitchen now that I eat less grains and beans. There are many good books based on sound research that in fact demonstrate that the Paleo diet is not based on fantasy, but on the diet of our ancestors. In fact, humans ate “Paleo” for much longer than they have eaten from agricultural crops. Just because cultures with weapons and horses wiped out cultures that did not still doesn’t support the theory that the paleo diet isn’t healthy, in fact that is another topic altogether.
You may want to actually research the diet you profess to dislike before you share your opinions of it. I recommend “The Vegetarian Myth” because unlike your article it is very well written and researched. In it Lierre Kieth explores the hazards of agriculture on our earth and health………Bon Appetit!
I love the different point of view… but I have to ask… I have horrible digestion and I want to heal it but GAPS really did me in… my digestion was great but I was unable to keep it up. My adrenals when crazy. Can you heal on WAPF… all the ferments and sprouted grains? Is it worth a shot? any tips? I see another “diet” as stressful as I am healing adrenal fatigue as well.
thanks for some freedom
and I find it so funny that people freak out and get angry about this. I figure that figure that as with anything in life you need to study your options and decide what is right… believing what you want and NOT getting up in arms seems the healthy option to me. I see nothing wrong with this post.
@Jackie
I love the different point of view… but I have to ask… I have horrible digestion and I want to heal it but GAPS really did me in… my digestion was great but I was unable to keep it up. My adrenals when crazy. Can you heal on WAPF… all the ferments and sprouted grains? Is it worth a shot? any tips? I see another “diet” as stressful as I am healing adrenal fatigue as well.
Yes, I did. When I healed from chronic fatigue syndrome and arthritis, I only gave up gluten and sugar. I still ate all other grains (corn, rice, etc.) and I still ate honey and fruit. Strong probiotics really helped me a lot, and it was necessary for me to stay off gluten and sugar for 2 years.
thats amazing! where you doing ferments and such? I have been off of sugar and gluten but I am not too sure the the alternitives where prepared the best. Plus I yo yo with eating… I am just not hungry even when I NEED to eat. Hoping to heal that too! Thanks for the encouragement!!!
No I was not doing ferments. This was in 1995 when I didn’t know anything about fermented food! I just took therapeutic grade probiotics.
do you have a recommended brand? I am starting the refridgerated Garden of Life and switching off and on with Trinity… but thats because thats all I saw that looked ok. I don’t know much about what makes a good probiotic…
Thanks for your time and info!!!
Jackie, I think the best brand is Bio-Kult, which was formulated by Dr Natasha Campbell McBride, who wrote and created the GAPS system of eating. It has many strains, and a good mixture of bacterias. I order mine in bulk on Amazon, which makes it a lot cheaper. All good probiotics are going to be a bit expensive, but in my experience Bio-Kult isn’t much more expensive than any other good quality probiotic.
I am not Paleo, and I have been a regular reader for some time, but I am surprised why you do not seem to understand (based on your response to comments) why this blog post would seem inflammatory. The post was a broad characterization that is contradicted by many of the comments I read by Paleo diet followers. Your response to many of the arguments against the article was to point out the specific fallacies the comments used and to say they are illogical. Some of your accusations of fallacy do not actually address the meat of the comment at all. Perhaps you should look for the fallacies in your own responses. If many strict paleo people have been unconscionably rude, shame on them, but this post smacks a little of “stooping to their level”. I am not writing this to argue the validity or not of the Paleo diet. I DO see the similarities from what I know about Paleo. I am only commenting to let you know you have lost a reader. It isn’t just the tone of this post. If you are vibrantly healthy eating grains and the occasional white flour, I am happy for you. I am not. I am doing GAPS to heal my digestive system since a WAPF diet alone was not enough. I only have time for information which is useful for my situation, and right now it would seem the Paleo sites you discount are more useful to me.
I have my previous comment, but wasn’t able to delete. I read this blog post shortly after finding a lot of really helpful recipes and information in my path to healing food sensitivities, and I can see why the tone of this blog post might upset paleo diet eaters. Yet when it comes down to it, there are many other blog posts on your site which have been very helpful to me including the blueberry coconut muffins post, and the post on ceviche. I like the points you make elsewhere on your blog about how much happier you and your family are now that you have loosened up on the obsessiveness with healthy eating. Between being a foodie and having food sensitivities I aspire to reach the point where I feel like I can be more relaxed about what we eat. Thanks
This is a great post, I agree with every single point. In my family we restrict ourselves with the meat, not because we are this or that, but simply because we disagree with the way most animals are raised for consumption. We usually try getting either Amish chicken or other local, pasture raised meat (lot’s of liver and such), which is expensive, so we stretch it as much as we can. Someone once argued with me saying that there is no way the amount of animals necessary to feed all the people can be raised roaming free, happy, in green pastures. I told this person he was right, and that was exactly why we cannot take meat for granted like we do. So this decision makes sense for me, and like you said, has some logic behind it. Paleo doesn’t make sense to me either, much like the raw diet doesn’t, at least not the ones that strive to only eat raw. Balance is the key, always. Thanks again for the great post, I already bookmarked your blog
I didn’t read all the comments but some of the things said are just overboard. I mean it’s one thing to judge but another to tell someone they can’t even talk about things they don’t like. So let her call it the way she sees it and if it you don’t wanna hear it then don’t even worry about it. Also check out this article on phytic acid and phytase paticulary the section “Phytic acid friend or foe”. http://info.breadbeckers.com/phytic-acid/
That article on phytic acid was really interesting – thank you for sharing it. It makes me think that the most nutritious aspect to eating whole grains is that they’re freshly ground, not necessarily that they’re soaked, sprouted, or fermented (though these are all good things to do). And really, this is what Weston A Price seemed to say, too.
Hallejulah! You are a rockstar! Cheers to you for not being afraid to say you enjoy cheese and bread. Why can’t we all just get along and try to convert those who are eating Frosted Flakes and Mc Donalds instead of bashing each other? Real food is the way to go period. We should rally against the modern industrial diets.
Our table is a bounty of berries, greens, root vegetables and natural meat. If you were a guest at our house for a week I think you’d leave very happy, nourished and full. I have a feeling that I’d more than enjoy eating at your table too. Let’s rejoice that we’re not eat the SAD!!! Why draw lines? I didn’t even know the way I was eating was a fad (or that it had a name) until you pointed it out. I was proud to be putting in the effort and budget to eat this way. I hope your list doesn’t change that for me
So.
What’s everyone having for dinner tonight?
I am very disappointed in this article. Very ignorant and no scientific knowledge to base it off of. Just rambling of someone uneducated is how it sounded. I’m not all paleo but your article is rediculous and very misleading. Poorly done poorly done:-(
I feed my family paleo-lite. We cheat here and there. And eat some dairy. And everything you said makes total sense to me.
Hello! New liker of your blog. I really enjoyed your post. Going to read older ones now! I agree with you, the Paleo diet (to me) doesn’t make sense. Good for those who do it and find that it works for them (said sincerely, not sarcastically). Just figured you could use another positive comment after all the really negative, hateful ones. Keep on keepin’ on!
@ElisaM
Thank you!
Hugs!
I love this post. You are hilarious and your list is awesome. I cracked up at the picture of the monkey man.
Keep on keeping on, Ann Marie!!
@Sarah Faith
Ha! That picture cracked me up, too.
I’m glad we share the same sense of humor. I was being cheeky in this post and it’s nice to hear from someone who gets it.
xoxoxo
Thank you
I love this post. I know, you’ll get lots of debate and comments, but not from me. We eat whole foods, a balance, sort of low/mixed high density carbs, mix the meats, fresh fruits and lots of veggies. I make almost everything from scratch and we love cheese, olives, sweets here and there, wine and so on. We are also very healthy…so I’d say much of what you wrote is spot on. Life is too short for us to argue, we need to each do our research and find balance.
Enjoy ALL there is to do in this world!
@Helen Russo
Do you want to come write blog posts for me? No, seriously I am NOT being sarcastic — I really, really mean it. SO WELL said! That was what I was TRYING to say but you said it so much better.
Holding up my wine glass and sending you a virtual toast!
xoxoxo
I’ve always appreciated your posts because I felt that you had a very realistic handle on how it is to eat healthily in this world; meaning most people cheat here and there. When you have young, picky kids (and yes, they were always raised to eat real food) and a husband who isn’t entirely convinced, cheating will occur. I also appreciate this post because you found what works for you! Not one person is the same as the other and one approach to health definitely does not fit all. For me personally, I don’t really eat grains at all–it makes me feel sluggish, even when properly prepared. But, for my husband, he feels just fine on grains. I’m just happy he eats our diet now because it has changed so much!
Thanks for all that you do!
i’m not sure where you learned about the paleo diet but the paleo diet you’re describing has as much resemblance to mine as chalk has to cheese.
i eat virtually zero grains – oats, quinoa, and psyllium is about it for me – bec wheat makes me feel like crap. i don’t eat a lot of potatoes bec ditto. i absolutely LOVE baked goods – bread, cakes, pastries, etc – but i absolutely HATE how i feel after: tired, groggy, logey, bloated, and either back-up or with a loose, soupy gut (you know that gurgling “floopy” feeling just before you have to make a break for the facilities? yeah – that one). the pleasure of a few moments savouring baked goods is completely not worth the hours of embarrassment and discomfort afterward – and no, i don’t have celiac, IBF, or anything like it and i apparently tested negative for wheat allergy.
paleo isn’t a bunch of “thou shalt” and “thou shalt not” – it’s not weight watchers.
my paleo diet is simple: if i cannot identify it by eye, i don’t eat it. that rules out a whole lot of (expensive) stuff and makes meals a lot easier to prepare.
i approach articles with the same attitude: if the author has to pander to emotions by using cute little catch-phrases, scapegoating, and blame-gaming, then the content is probably weak and cannot stand on its own merit.
The Scots have the highest rates of diabetes and metabolic syndrome in the EU.
Or the Scots who ate 50% of their diet as soaked oats. They were vibrantly healthy eating whole grains.”
@Todd
The Scots that Dr. Weston Price studied ate a VERY different diet than the modern Scottish diet. The people he visited who were healthy with no signs of degenerative disease had almost no access to modern industrial foods.
A dietary program competent to build stalwart men and women and rugged boys and girls is provided the residents of these barren Islands, with their wind and storm-swept coasts, by a diet of oats used as oatcake and oatmeal porridge; together with fish products, including some fish organs and eggs.
The people he saw in Scotland who had cavities and disease had abandoned their traditional diet; they ate a modern diet of industrial foods:
A seriously degenerated stock followed the displacement of this diet with a typical modern diet consisting of white bread, sugar, jams, syrup, chocolate, coffee, some fish without livers, canned vegetables, and eggs.
– Dr. Weston Price in his book, Nutrition & Physical Degeneration
http://journeytoforever.org/farm_library/price/price4.html
It sounds like it was the potatoes and turnips and not oats that made up the bulk of the Scottish diet.
”
Neeps [turnip], of course, only became a common field crop in the early 1700s. And, while the turnip has never been celebrated in verse, it was the first root vegetable, and the first vitamin C, made widely available to many Scots. Tatties [potatoes] became a vital staple shortly afterwards, saving the poorest Highlanders and islanders from economic ruin and fatal malnutrition.”
I don’t mean to attack you with this observation, Cheeseslave, but it appears that Price’s book is your bible. Even today, with all our technology and education, we have experts that disagree on the details of what certain cultures are eating. Why is it that you believe that Price is beyond reproach? According to Malnutrition in Scotland since 1700, and its social consequences- [Soc Soc Hist Med Bull (Lond). 1986 Jun;38:17-8.], the Scots did not have a healthy, thriving population during the time that Price visited them.
Todd,
Do keep in mind that Dr. Price visited the peoples living in the Outer Hebrides. Confirming what the good doctor wrote regarding the remoteness of these people, Wikipedia states:
Sea transport is crucial and a variety of ferry services operate between the islands and to mainland Scotland. Modern navigation systems now minimise the dangers but in the past the stormy seas have claimed many ships.
In the 1930s, Dr. Price was observing a culture still untouched by what he referred to as “the displacing foods of modern commerce” which was not the case for mainland Scots.
The inhabitants of these remote islands created a dietary program based on what was available to them locally, and nothing else. I believe that accounts for the level of physical and character perfection Dr. Price recorded.
A.
OK- from the same resource-
“The mainstay of their food supplies was the profusion of island birds, especially gannet and fulmar. These they harvested as eggs and young birds and ate both fresh and cured. Adult puffins were also caught by the use of fowling rods.”
This doesn’t sound like a diet based on oats, but rather on poultry.
I’m having trouble finding the quote you’re referencing above in the article I referred to. Would you share the paragraph it came from?
In any event, I also found this quote, which throws into question the validity of the entire article:
“There were gradual economic improvements, among the most visible of which was the replacement of the traditional thatched black house with accommodation of a more modern design.”
What’s not said, is that although the residents did indeed move into the new and “improved” cottages provided by the government, they retained their thatched roof dwellings (in which they kept a fire going at all times) for the purpose of fertilizing their oat fields.
A.
My apologies, by same resource, I meant Wiki, not the same article. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_Kilda,_Scotland
Gotcha. Okay, so according to Dr. Price’s book Nutrition and Physical Degeneration, he did not visit St. Kilda, but rather the Isle of Lewis, Harris and Skye (where the traditional diet consisted of oats, seafood and a small amount of dairy) as well as the Isle of Bardsey off the northwest coast of Wales (where the displacing foods were to be found).
I’ve included another quote from the original Wiki article on the Outer Hebrides:
“This process involved a transition from these places being perceived as relatively self-sufficient agricultural economies, to a view becoming held by both island residents and outsiders alike that they lacked the essential services of a modern industrial economy.”
A.
So would it not then be more honest to say that Price found that people on two tiny Scottish islands (rather than the all-encompassing “Scots”) ate the oats? I realize it’s not nearly as impressive an argument in favor of eating grains, but at least it’s genuine.
I’m not debating the grain versus no grain argument. Dr. Price found cultures around the globe who did eat grains, as well as cultures who didn’t. It didn’t seem to make a lot of difference to their dental, infectious and degenerative disease immunity whether they did or did or did not.
What did make a huge difference, was whether or not the grain eaters ate them whole, sprouted and ultimately fermented, in combination with “sacred” foods rich in the fat soluble activators.
It also mattered to both grain and non-grain eating cultures alike, whether or not they consumed sugar and/or foods that contained it.
A.
I understand that Annie, but Cheeseslave IS debating grain versus no grain… and it was HER original claim that I was commenting on.
This post is wrong on so many levels, you are completely misinformed, it’s very sad. NO wonder thyroid problems are growing out of control with these type of beliefs.
@Todd
Sorry Todd, I didn’t mean to co-opt your dialogue with Ann Marie. This being an open discussion/debate, I’m just seeking intriguing participants to converse with on this fascinating topic!
A.
Hi Ann,
I think people just get too attached to names. What is it to eat “paleo”, really? To me – and I do say to other people that “I eat paleo” – it’s about eating real, whole foods in an *evolutionary informed* way. I’m not trying to reenact anything – and if you read around the so called “paleoshpere” you’ll see most people don’t try to do it either.
You say “the only foods that are allowed are ones that were available prior to the dawn of agriculture 10,000 years ago” – well, I eat cheese and butter pretty much on a daily basis. Am I not allowed to say I eat paleo then? I guess what I’m trying to say is we can’t read “paleo” the same way we read “vegan”. For me, paleo is a set of loose guidelines, a framework. I don’t even eat low carb: in the last two days I ate bananas, mashed potatoes, sweet potatoes, mangos.
For me, honestly, a waste of time would be soaking grains and beans.
I would agree with you on these points, however, most are not actually representative of most people who follow a paleo type diet. I really like cheese too. I occasionally have some. Most “paleo people” are down with the fermented food products. The only reason anyone recommends caution is because a lot of people can’t digest dairy well. But if you can (like you and I-lucky us!), go for it. No one would argue that antibiotics are not a much bigger concern than bread. That being said, most people are not soaking/fermenting/then baking their own grains (you bring up Weston Price and that was something noted over and over in his travels…soaking/fermenting/then cooking the grains before consuming). And yes, there is science to say that bread really can be that bad for you. Lots of it. As for cookies, cakes and pies…see bread. They’re just bread with lots more sugar, so same answer. Paleo is not low carb by default. It can be as low or high carb as you see fit. As long as you’re healthy and able to maintain your health goals, and your carb sources are not unhealthy for you, whatever-chow down on some sweet potatoes! Some people do better with low carb, some people (you and I) do not. Yes, it is restrictive. You shouldn’t eat crap. If you are sad about not eating crap, well, go ahead and eat it I guess (and by you I don’t mean YOU, I mean anyone that will be upset they can’t have their daily ho ho and still say they eat “paleo”). But recommending that most of the time you eat foods that are good for you instead of bad? That’s a GOOD restriction in my book! As for fantasy/impracticality (this is the reason I actually decided to comment) most of us are not those nutters that journalists like to interview and film while they go on some spear hunting trip who claim they don’t eat anything they didn’t kill or forage. The closest I’ve come to foraging was going through the weekly add for a good price on kale and grass fed beef. We’re not interested in returning to the wild or something. We’re just trying to be the healthiest versions of ourselves, and look to what our bodies are better adapted to in order to achieve that health. 10,000 years is the blink of an eye when it comes to what our bodies understand as food. I suppose I’m lucky in that there are 2 grocery stores within walking distance, and yes, I have to go a couple times a week for my greens, but that’s life! You should be doing that anyway to get enough veggies to stay healthy. Oh, and you’ll never catch me saying “that’s not paleo” unless I’m joking. And again, that’s most of us. Sure, look for them and you’ll find the extreme people that only eat “100% Paleo! 100% of the time!” but you’ll find extremes in any type of diet/lifestyle combo – see vegans if you think it’s just us meat lovers
That’s my 2 cents. You may think I don’t like your blog, but I just found it, and I do like it!
I’m not “paleo” either, but I’m confused by some of your reasons. You’re certainly not the only one who thinks paleo has to be low carb, but a lot of fruits and roots/tubers are considered paleo. That also leads me to wonder why you’re comparing the cost of bread with the cost of beef – why not compare bread and sweet potatoes?
Considering that the WAPF also includes that same beef, this would make sense to me too.
Here’s another important fact. If you want to base your conclusions on scientific research then guess what? Then nothing you find is certain. You can have a theory meaning something that’s been tested over and over that keeps producing the same results but if some other facts come up in contradiction you have to modify that theory. Thus in general you’ll hear scientists say their conclusions are very likely (i.e there are uncertainties) but if any contradictions come up they have to start over with their hypotheses, experiments, observations, and forming theories. That’s science. So say your lifestyle is what you believe don’t argue paleo is better unless you’re God.
First, I just want to make sure people know that Primal and Paleo are not interchangeable. Primal allows dairy if you’re not intolerant and is more lax about a few other things. Paleo is not the same as Primal.
Once you allow dairy, you can enjoy cheese, yogurt, butter, all the yummy stuff you can get out of domesticated mammals. Thanks to freezers, it’s pretty easy to store veggies all year round. Depending on how much fruit and potatoes and squash you eat, it’s not necessarily all that low carb. And you can still enjoy (as I do!) pies, breads, and other desserts by using almond flour, coconut flour, etc.
I just think that a lot of your critiques could be made about your own way of eating. For example, sprouting your own grains and making your own bread sounds like a lot more work than I’m up for! Throwing a chicken thigh on the grill and tossing some veggies in a vinaigrette sounds a lot easier to me! And I have never seen sprouted bread on a menu at a restaurant, so it’s just easier not to order a sandwich, or just not eat the bread.
And as someone already mentioned, any diet followed 24/7 is going to be restrictive and suffocating. I need my 80/20 so I can enjoy that buttery croisant or crispy sourdough!
That said, I’m totally with you on #1!
My two cents, from someone that is paleo:
1. Agreed, I love cheese, and i eat it
2. I like break too, too bad it gives me heartburn and gas
3. same as 2, but i eat them more often than bread
4. wrong, it can be low carb, but it can also be high carb. if you don’t understand that, then maybe you just don’t understand paleo
5. disagree
6. um, what? technology is great, how does that make grains an ideal food?
7. fantasy for who? how does this make real food bad for you, and crap food good for you? I am really not getting your point.
8. It can be a challange keeping the fridge stocked with fresh veggies. Oh well, I guess I’ll have to go to the store mid-week and miss an episode of the bachelor.
9. it can be expensive, but doesn’t have to be. when ever you choose quality, you will pay more. $3.50 for a pound of ground beef, which give you more nutrition than 4 pounds of bread.
10. I agree, we should all stop talking about weather honey is paleo or not. Other than that, if you really think discussions about what food is healthy, and how to improve lives is a waste of time, then please tell me what your blog is about.
I would just like to say: YOLO. If someone feels they are thriving health-wise, physically & emotionally with the inclusion of grains &/or dairy &/or legumes, then please wish them well & let them do their own thing. Forcing someone to try & see your point of view when they clearly are happy with the way their diet is at the present is only causing frustration for both parties; we only get one life, so creating negativity over something so personal as diet can be so detrimental. I should know. I suffered with anorexia very bad in the past, & the religious dogma of diets & eating restrictions is what fueled my obsessive behavior. I guess you could say I was affected by orthorexia as well. Both issues fueled the other. The fear of getting fat. The fear of ‘unhealthy’ foods… I devoted myself to trying to be the cleanest-eating raw vegan on the planet, & it really felt like a prison. I wasn’t doing it for the animals, I was doing it for the fear that eating one single serving of bread would make me gain 5 pounds overnight. Or a chuck of cheese would bloat me out for months. That is no way to live. I’ve never felt more free than I do now, still eating a nutrient-dense diet but with more natural VARIETY. Granted, I am still a vegetarian, but that is only because my family cannot afford pastured natural meats or wild seafood. I swore of dairy & eggs for 3 years of my life. I wasted 3 years of my life starving & bingeing & never feeling sated from the food I ate. Veganism was my cult, which I guess some people can relate to when they first heard of paleo. I know this is all very rambly & not on point, I’m sorry. I’m an 18 year old girl from England who just wants to let people know that there is more to life than what you eat, & that if you do eat sourdough bread & pastured butter you will not automatically get fat. My weight actually got to it’s highest on a cooked/raw vegan diet. Since being a WAPF-style eating vegetarian my weight has lowered. I am 5 foot 11. My highest weight was 11 stone. My lowest 6 stone 11 pounds (for my height that made me VERY emaciated-looking) & now I am 9 stone, eating cheeses, breads, ice creams, butter, cream… I feel like I have woke up. I can eat real food that tastes delicious & not get fatter, but thinner! I see it that I had an intoxicating addition to nutritional leadership from gurus of health, & having a perfectionistic nature only fueled my desire to have the ‘perfect’ diet. Food isn’t everything. Eat natural, eat tasty, & by default now I eat only as much as I need. No more binges. No more stress over food choices. RAMBLE RAMBLE, I’m so sorry. I needed to vent I guess, hehe. & FYI: I don’t get tummy aches or anything from gluten-foods or casein-foods… I can tolerate them & they have made me happier, so how are they not healthy TO ME? Of course in the future if I ever experience discomfort eating a certain food, I will not eat it. I see it like if a food doesn’t taste good to me, I will not eat it. Eat foods that make you happy & keep you happy (meaning in robust health & in shape) <3
Casper Indigo,
I’m so glad to hear how much you’ve healed yourself. Thank you for sharing your story. Continued good health to you.
Wow! All I can say is that I agree 100%. I have Rheumatoid Arthritis and am on the Paleo Diet because food sensitivity tests say I’m reacting to all grains and dairy and coffee and chocolate. In fact, I’m “reacting” to so many foods that there’s not much left to eat and I keep loosing weight (I didn’t need to loose weight, but have lost 10 lbs). I don’t feel any better either.
Weird.
Switching my entire family over to an 80/20 Primal/Paleo nutritional lifestyle immediately cessated my children’s allergies (allergy related asthma; lactose intolerance and eczema). Watching my child gasp for air because of a reaction to something he’s eaten was all the incentive I needed to become proactive in my son’s health to determine what else, in addition to the following the pharmaceutical support he needed for his condition, I could do to reduce the incidence of allergens in his life. I researched and researched and researched and consulted with his primary and allergist. Paleo was the dramatic answer to staving off his allergies – it began to help him almost immediately. Ironically, his complete turn around by changing his diet has prompted a change in the doctors attitudes as well, as they found it helpful to know how significant these everyday food items (pizza, gluten foods, dairy) impacted my son. And he had been tested for every allergen out there. We don’t eat at fast food/pizza places anymore and I’m not a bad parent for denying them this type of junk….After cooking Paleo and the kids feeling so much better, they, on their own made the connection that eating fast food and processed food made them feel terrible. They don’t want any part of processed or fast foods anymore. Cooking with fresh organic fruits and veggies, great quality meats and seafood has made all the difference. They prefer my meals over the junk now. Perhaps your body processes foods differently from most, which may explain why you can eat all those delicious breads? That’s great, but my family cannot. Luck of the draw I guess, but scandalizing and disparaging a whole populace of Paleo eaters for taking inventory of the dietary influences on their health isn’t the answer either. I wish you had done some more research or a minimum, tried it for 30 days to see if there was any merit to your thinking. Maybe you will? Who knows… My experience with Paleo has been completely positive. I feel badly for you that your perspective seems so narrow-minded and unsubstantiated.
It doesn’t really matter what causes gluten intolerance. If you suffer from gluten intolerance, for whatever reason, you shouldn’t eat anything containing gluten. Sadly, a lot of people have undiagnosed ailments that are caused by eating gluten. They don’t realize the reason they have bouts of IBS, or chronic heartburn, etc., is caused by eating gluten. I’m not saying those conditions are only caused by gluten, but sometimes they are.
I raise pigs on pasture. The pigs walk along through pastures picking off the grain heads when they get the chance. Some of the grain they chew and digest. Other grains just come out the back end ready to grow in the rich manure. I strongly suspect that our paleo ancestors did the same thing, picking off the heads, munching as they walked, planting as they pooped. Grains and grain eaters co-evolved to help each other out. Same goes for fruit and nuts. Heck, same goes for meat. Those smart pigs now out populate most other species because their bacon tastes soooo good that we’ve defended them from predators. Smart food.
Hey at least the guys over at Copy Blogger & Pro Blogger would be proud of you. That being said , your missing the point to the whole Paleo craze.
30 day buy in …strict Paleo. Modify from there and reintroduce cheese, diary or grains at your own discretion. It’s rather quit simple. I started eating Paleo a little over a year ago.
No allergies this year. Strength has gone through the roof at the gym. Granted that is only because Paleo made me more aware of how important it is to understand the macro-nutrient breakdown of each meal and how to eat to goal etc.
Your next post should be: 10 Reasons why I Don’t Do Crossfit. Back to Back home-runs lol.
I agree with those who don’t try to strictly follow a paleo diet, but rather use it and modern medical studies as a template for eating healthy today. You can find good stuff along those lines at places like Chris Kessler’s blog.
Personally, I could never sustain myself on meat, fat, fruit and veggies. Or at least I wouldn’t want to. That doesn’t mean I get to eat bread. There are all sorts of more healthy and nutritionally dense carbs available than wheat. Foods such as potatoes, yams, sweet potatoes, white rice, dairy products if they are tolerated by the individual.
At it’s best, wheat is a nutritionally poor food choice compared to tons of other options. At it’s worst, wheat (gluten) causes ailments in a lot of people.
I haven’t had any wheat based bread, cake, desert, pasta, etc. for almost 2 years now. You can survive without eating wheat!
I cheat on eating “paleo-like” all the time too. Last night I had a bowl of chocolate Rice Chex. Tons of sugar and corn. Basically junk food. I’m not proud of that per se, but I still got a sugar/carb fix without resorting to eating wheat.
I subscribe to this blog and many others like it, with my sole intention being able to broaden my horizons and in a way, interact with people in this “community,” who have similar concerns regarding food and health. I think a lot of the time that is what a lot of us are looking for, someone to relate to. I love the WAPF and their work. Tragically I don’t have many friends or people in my life who understand my need for raw milk or love of butter. To me, that is what makes blogs like this a wonderful venue for people to come together, swap opinions, share stories and relate. I was completely disheartened by some of the comments left. I believe the author wrote this with good intentions. I believe she was simply expressing to the members of this “community” why she doesn’t prescribe to the paleo lifestyle. She didn’t “bash” it, but instead gave clear, concise reasons for her choice. That being the most important word, her choice. People who enjoy the Paleo lifestyle, that’s good – it’s so very important we all find something that suits our needs. But to come onto a blog and “bash” her opinions is nothing short of rude. No one forced you to read this blog or make a comment, again, it all comes down to personal choices. And some have made the choice to be rude and not at all understanding of the way others live their lives. I use a traditional diet and my brother uses a paleo. It’s surprisingly how many commonalities we have – and we certainly never bicker about whose choice is better. It’s not worth the time or energy because in the end we’re both working towards a common goal, a healthful life – recognizing that the foods we eat are an integral part of that. So in that way, the different choices we’ve made aren’t that different at all. So I say props to the author and thank you for what you do!
Great post, thanks for taking the time to outline your reasoning- it definitely gave me a chance to stop and think about and remember all of the reasons our family does follow a Paleo diet.
Your reason #8 really struck me, because I too have learned from many parents whose children are on the autistic spectrum that once grains are removed from their diet, and dairy, the daily challenges greatly improved, as did the entire family’s quality of life.
So, I have to add to this- there is a great book titled The Four A’s: A Childhood Epidemic, in which the author (an MD) discusses the research showing that 1 in 3 children suffer from one of the four A’s: allergies, asthma, autism, and ADHD. What is interesting is that all of these epidemics have symptoms that are often most notably managed by diet. And the diet that most often reduces symptoms and helps these children (and their families) enjoy an improved quality of life is a grain-free, dairy-free diet, and once void of artificial colors and flavors.
So, while my children do not suffer from the above, they are sensitive to gluten and casein, which is most obviously noticed in e allergy shiners they exhibit after eating these foods.
Which leads me to your reason #5- yes, our American diet is saturated in grains and dairy galore, pizza shops on every corner, nachos at every football event, etc…but our culture is also dominated by fast foods and literal junk, chok-full of artificial colors and flavors (made wi petrol, by the way). So, yes, telling my child he can’t have a slice of pizza at a birthday party totally stinks for him, but if I based every parenting decision on what was convenient and on the basis that it is all around us, then I guess those neon green Popsicles are ok, as well as the Capri sun junk handed out after a baseball game, and the fake chocolate milk boxes and fried churros…I mean, it’s everywhere so we should just give in right?
Well, let me tell you- because so many children suffer from the 4 As, parents are demanding stricter dietary standards all around, and local pizzerias now carry gluten free pizza. Our local market now carries coconut milk ice cream, and when we go to events in our town, my children can enjoy a delicious all natural soda treat that contains nothing artificial, including the high fructose corn syrup that you’ll find all over the place that is contributing to obesity in our culture and goodness knows what else (though we can take our guesses- cancer, disease, etc).
So, yes, you are right- Paleo is not easy or convenient, and it is restrictive. But what are we restricting- the junk all round us? In that case, I’m ok with that. Hopefully it will force more companies to look at the quality of their food and support more healthful companies who are interested in offering natural products, that fuel our bodies instead of pollute them.
Thanks for sharing that Vanessa. And I’ve been meaning to get that book!
“Is the modern epidemic of “gluten intolerance” really caused by eating wheat? Or is it possible that something else is causing gluten intolerance? There is a theory that antibiotic drugs cause an imbalance of gut flora and cause prevent the digestive tract from secreting enzymes that enable us to break down complex proteins such as gluten. Sounds a lot more plausible than the idea that wheat suddenly started causing gluten intolerance out of nowhere.”
Before I begin, I hope I speak for everyone sensitive to wheat gluten (of which you were one at one time, I believe) when I say shame on you for the tone of your post. It could have been a light-hearted and fun post, too. Trivializing gluten intolerance as a non-existent hypochondriacal syndrome by putting in it quotes as if we are “making it up” further alienates what seems to be a large follower base. I apologize if you didn’t intend for the sentence to be read this way, but I assume that it would be interpreted offensively by many others, and you may consider changing how you refer to “gluten intolerance” in the future.
In the first place, the alternative theory isn’t bad. I agree that something other than gluten could be causing gluten intolerance. Genetics, a changing gut microbiome, antibiotics, sugar, birth control, whatever. Alternative theories are fine and dandy, but why would you just dismiss gluten as if it were an innocent bystander? It’s been pointed out multiple times already on the thread that modern grain and refined wheat products contain much more gluten than the fermented breads of the “bible days.” Gluten is actually a very good candidate for “causing” “gluten intolerance”, as the protein has been demonstrated to be inflammatory and barrier-compromising to the intestinal tract all on it’s own. It also stimulates antigen presenting cells to be “preactivated” among “normal” healthy individuals without celiac disease or gluten sensitivity. Positive benefits of gluten-removal from IBS patients who did not have clinical celiac disease has also been demonstrated. But a different cause for gluten intolerance doesn’t justify continuing to eat it. It would still be a “gluten intolerance”; wheat’s fault, or not.
In the second place, gluten isn’t the only thing found in wheat. Wheat germ agglutinin (WGA) is a lectin found in wheat and has been demonstrated to have antinutritive effects irrespective of gluten intolerance and celiac disease. Concentrations of WGA are higher in the seed and young shoots of wheat, to protect it from predation from fungus, insects, and animals. In fungus and insects WGA binds to the chitin. Chitin is found in the cell wall and intestinal system of fungi and insects, respectively. In animals and in humans, it binds strongly to sialic acid on intestinal cells, where it is internalized, and can also agglutinate bacteria and red blood cells. Because it is stable at low pH (i.e. poorly digested) and resistant to gut proteases, it is gaining widespread attention and research to be utilized as a carrier for drug delivery. Once inside epithelial cells of the digestive tract, it accumulates in lysosomes and resists degradation. It alters intestinal permeability, allowing for the passage of small molecules across the intestinal barrier. In addition, in sufficient concentrations, it stimulates proinflammatory cytokine release as well as affecting the activation of immune cells in the gut, and can cause pancreatic hypertrophy. It should be mentioned here that lectins are not only found in wheat (but wheat has among the highest lectin concentrations and is the most prevalent plant lectin), and their entrance into the blood stream and implications on systemic health has yet to be widely investigated. How is that for your “antimicrobial” theory?
I appreciate the different opinion, and I also love cheese. But, maybe you should conduct a little more research before posting “facts.” Feel free to view my responding post at http://www.autoimmunepatient.com.
I didn’t post it here for fear that you might delete the post!
Cheeseslave,
It seems you have written this article based on false assumptions.
1. Cheese is neither paleo/not paleo. It depends on whether you tolerate it or not without gut distress, or other issues with regard to milk sugars, milk fat, or milk proteins. We all react to food differently. And paleo is about removing neolithic foods then slowly adding certain things back to see how you react to each food. Self experimentation is a large part of it. Raw milk is also promoted. I love raw milk and cheese.
2. That’s nice that you love bread. Paleo dieters chose to give it up because of the many adverse health effects. You may not care about perfect health. That’s your decision. Us paleo dieters, however, are for the most part, perfectionists. We strive for perfect health. Plus bread is mostly nutrient void sugar calories. I get chronic heartburn from regular grain consumption. I also get acne, headaches, fluctuating energy levels, eczema, esopagheal spasm. And I’m not celiac. I’m sure a lot of people experience these things and consider them “normal”. I guess if you don’t mind the constant problems, go ahead and eat your bread!
3. Sweets, for the same reason, we avoid. They are unhealthy. Occasional indulgence isn’t too harmful. I know eating that stuff makes me crash n burn. It’s not worth it, so I avoid it. Plus sugar makes you fat. It’s about weighing pros and cons. If you like to make excuses, go ahead and say “paleo is too restrictive”. Whatever. Have fun with the diabetes.
4. Paleo is not low carb per se. It only cuts out the junk carbs that are not real food, like sugar and grains. Starchy veggies and fruit are still “allowed”. Again it’s flexible, based on personal tolerance and activity level. Self experimentation again.
5. Paleo is not restrictive. I eat as much as I want. Huge delicious meals full of flavor. Tons of butter, spices, healthy animal fats, meat, veggies, olive oil, seafood, coconut, etc. The only thing we avoid is highly processed foods and packaged junk, again, grains, sugar, legumes, industrial veggie oils. It’s more than just “what’s paleo”. It’s also about the science and biology. we understand very intimately what these things do to our body. And we chose to avoid them for long term heath. You, however, may not actually care about your health in the long term, or chose to ignore the science. Either way, Paleo definitely isn’t restrictive.
6. There are still successful hunter gatherer tribes in existence. The ones that don’t rely on modern foods or agriculture are healthy and disease free.
7 Paleo isn’t based on fantasy. It’s based on the model of overall health and freedom from disease and degenerative disorders. Sure they lived a harsh life. But the paleo diet isn’t a reenactment, it’s a framework for long term health utilizing diet and exercise in the context of our modern world. We still live normal lives. I’m just healthier and better looking than I used to be. One thing I noticed for sure, I started putting on muscle and getting that six pack to come in! I don’t know about you, but I’d say not being sick for an entire year or more also speaks for itself!
8. It sure is practical. We, again, aren’t going out to forage. We shop in the store for what’s available like modern humans, hahaahha. The fact you think paleo is such a reenactment is comical.
9. It’s definitely not expensive. Read my post about the “Homeless Paleo Guide”. It’s funny but also serious. You can follow paleo diet and be totally healthy on a very low income: http://musclegeek.wordpress.com/2012/06/29/homeless-paleo-guide/
10. It takes very little time and energy. Since I only eat nutrient dense foods, I don’t get hungry as often, therefore I don’t need to eat as much, therefore there is less time spent both chewing and coking/preparing. This is another reason that paleo is more affordable. I buy only what is necessary, no fillers, no junk food, no snacks. Don’t need ‘em, don’t want ‘em. Again, I may think my health is more important than being able to eat junk food. And maybe you just like junk food more than you want to be healthy. That’s your choice, but based on your wild eggagerations above, you just have no idea what paleo actually is about.
Next time, it might be wise to read up a little on the most recent level minded science based discussions in the paleosphere, rather than making it sound like a silly reenactment. Wouldn’t it be funny though…If we all had to wear loin cloths and actually hunt for our food to consider ourselves “paleo”. Good thing that’s not the case. hah.
re: #3 <>
do you think you might have insulin resistance?(pre-diabetic condition) have you had yourself tested? that is a symptom of crash and burn.
Just wondering.
thanks
Norma
All the more reason a paleo diet should be followed… To address and prevent insulin resistance.
It’s not about what is ‘paleo’ or what ‘isn’t paleo’, it’s about optimum nutrition, it’s about fuelling your body with the best nutrition possible, it’s about making a choice between “is this healthy for me or not?”
I really couldn’t care less if it’s was how my ancestors ate, I care about how I feel and my health. Six months ago I started following a “paleo” diet and I’ve never felt better. At the end of the day healthy, whole, nutrient dense foods are always going to give you a better quality of life than convenient processesd modern/junk food.
And I LOVE cheese. And bread. And all things yummy of that gluten/lactose filled nature. But they make me feel like crap. I’d rather live without them and feel vibrant and full of energy than energy the momentary pleasure followed by a myriad of health problems.
Respectfully I couldn’t agree with you less!
Oh and just because you think something is hogwash, doesn’t mean it necessarily is hogwash. Out of interest have you read (with an open mind) WheatBelly or any other of the literature that supports a more natural, wholesome ‘paleo’ approach to nutrition?
Nobody is saying that you should eat anything that makes you feel like crap.
From Dr. Davis:
http://blog.trackyourplaque.com/2010/06/in-search-of-wheat-einkorn-and-blood-sugar.html
http://blog.trackyourplaque.com/2010/06/in-search-of-wheat-another-einkorn-experience.html
@todd – with all due respect, time to move along. Plenty of Paleos follow this blog and are not threatened by Cheeseslave’s experiences. Plenty of ex-Paleos are following this blog and have found themselves doing much better on 80/20, grains, ice cream and cake added back in their diet. Plenty of people who follow this blog do not worship evolution or adhere to the diet of a cave man. Some people do.
Few, if any follow SAD.
No need to try to convert those who subscribe to this blog…you can do that on your own blog.
HATERS GOTTA HATE
Hi,
Well, I gave up “‘paleo” for reasons somewhat similar to yours: I like cheese and bread too much and wasn’t convinced that there was anything so very bad about them. However, your arguments sound sometimes as if you haven’t read the arguments for the paleo diet. “Why isn’t it enough to go back one hundred years etc.” I think plenty of paleo blogs would have well-developed answers to that question. Same with the middle ages; I don’t think that was a particularly healthy time. The poor didn’t get enough meat and the rich ate too much flour/sugar. Even your WAP would say that much.
But it is simply wrong to describe paleo as “low-carb”. When I was paleo I was very far from being low-carb; I did avoid potatoes briefly just because I wanted to lose weight, but I ate parsnips, beets, carrots, turnips, and when I was over the weight-loss thing I added potatoes and sweet potatoes and saw nothing un-paleo about them.
As for bread, I wondered how much of it was an addiction. I was eating meat and fish and cheese on slices of tomatoes or cucumbers or other vegetables. When I decided to but some (real Weston-Price style) sourdough bread I found I prefered the vegetables.
Yes, it is very, very expensive. I assume the logic behind paleo is not that people should bankrupt themselves but that they should eat as well as they can afford to. Beans and rice are cheap fillers. Have as much as your budget demands, but as much “real food” (fish, meat, vegetables) as you can afford.
Paleo rebalanced my diet. Before paleo I was centering my meals either around bread or rice. Paleo put animals and fresh vegetables back in the center, where they belong.
Have you read Wheatbelly? Great book written by an MD. Thoroughly explains the problems people have with grains. Many people such as myself have gotten great relief by removing grains from their diet. Your critism of paleo does not seem to take this into account. I can appreciate your position. It is expensive, time consuming and a little elitist, but its also a good way at the very least to have some organization in your diet as you eliminate the grains.
Posted above:
From Dr. Davis:
http://blog.trackyourplaque.com/2010/06/in-search-of-wheat-einkorn-and-blood-sugar.html
http://blog.trackyourplaque.com/2010/06/in-search-of-wheat-another-einkorn-experience.html
There a difference between modern grains and heritage grains, and there’s also a difference between improperly prepared grains and properly prepared grains.
Thank you so much for this article, so encouraging to me! I believe most paleo’s, espcially the ones I here on podcasts, don’t have a large family. We are a single income, homeschooling family. If we didn’t have bread or bread products, my kids would starve! I soak about 80% of our grains and nuts. My kids have no weight issues or dental issues. We eat about 80/20 of a whole foods diet. That in itself is expensive enough! If I still couponed, I could cut my grocery $ in half, but we’d be eating cereal and poptarts.
@Marcee
Yeah, a lot of the paleo folks online are either young/single, are older and childless (or kids out of the home) or maybe have one child. I don’t think it’s realistic in this day and age to try to eat paleo (at least long-term) if you have a big family and/or a tight budget.
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